Author Topic: Advice On Setting Up A Flight Simulator in a Public Space  (Read 2833 times)

KetchikanMuseumsAK

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Advice On Setting Up A Flight Simulator in a Public Space
« on: December 17, 2019, 08:56:53 PM »
Hi! I am Erika Jayne ( erikaj@ktn-ak.us ) from Ketchikan Alaska!

I haven't played with a flight simulator since way way back with Flight Simulator 98--but in looking into user generated content and add-on content for more modern flight simulator programs this group (and the flights some of ya'll have posted on YouTube) kept popping up!

Ketchikan Museum's Tongass Historical Museum will have an aviation themed exhibition opening in March and running through 2021. I would love to set up a flight simulator in our program space  and download all of the fantastic content pertinent to our area of Southeastern Alaska.

I have been looking into other institutes (Air and Space, Science Centers, Aviation Museums ect..) and haven't quite figured out if its possible on our scale (small) and with minimal set up. (THree monitors, dedicated computer, simple controls, in such a way that users cant quit/navigate away from the flight sim).

We don’t intend to fabricate a full blown flight simulator with precision flight controls and a high learning curve… The idea is finding a way to let visitors have the experience of seeing our area of Southeastern Alaska from the cockpit of a plane (Something you all obviously enjoy too!!). The Microsoft Flight Simulator X and the flights/content covering our island here in Ketchikan and the various flightseeing tours to the Misty Fjords was our inspiration. Being able to put them in the pilot’s seat and let them navigate is what we are after. Which is why I am enthused to see if anyone can point me in the right direction.

Can you set up Flight Simulator X in such a way that someone can select a set flight plan and hit go and fly using a simple yoke and three levers for throttle, prop and mixture?

Thank you for any advice!!

I am downloading the Steam version of Flight Simulator X to try out and enjoy over the holiday, so I might have better questions for anyone interested or able to help out!

Feel free to message me- point me toward leads!

(I cross posted in the new introductions too)

Bradallen43

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Re: Advice On Setting Up A Flight Simulator in a Public Space
« Reply #1 on: December 17, 2019, 09:19:29 PM »
Hello and Welcome!!

 We're definitely big fans of the SE Alaska area and Misty Fjords NP here at RTMM. I've personally been fortunate enough to take a real flight with a small operator out of Ketchikan. Alaska Seaplanes met us on the dock and took us on a flight around the Misty Fjords area on a crystal clear blue day a couple of years ago. My wife and I were there on a cruise and had enough time to get a sight seeing flight in. 

 I'm sure that you'll find some great advice from our team here at Return to Misty Moorings on what you're looking to accomplish. FSX Steam and a good PC to run things with will be your first requirements to consider for sure. Especially if you're looking at using a three monitor set-up. I personally don't use that kind of configuration so I can't give you any advice on that. I'm sure Jeff and other's on our team who do use that set-up can chime in with what you'll need for that.

 A Flight Yoke and even Rudder pedals would definitely make things feel more real. Here's what I use and they both are pretty straight forward and easy to configure inside the simulator. I use a CH Products "Pro Pedals USB" for my rudder control, foot brakes. And I use a CH Products Flight Sim Yoke USB. Again, it's pretty easy to plug these in, calibrate them and they need a few buttons configured inside the sim to do certain things like Raise/Lower Landing Gear, flaps, etc. Not very difficult to get up and running though.

http://www.chproducts.com/Flight-Sim-Yoke-v13-d-705.html

http://www.chproducts.com/Pro-Pedals-v13-p-179.html#2

These are the choices I use and I've had very few challenges over the last 10 years with this hardware on my system. Other's may have their say on what they suggest and what they use of course. So, let's see what you might get from the other folks on our team.

Brad

jeff3163

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Re: Advice On Setting Up A Flight Simulator in a Public Space
« Reply #2 on: December 17, 2019, 11:36:06 PM »
Hello Erika,
     Welcome to RTMM's forum.  The presentation you are planning sounds great.  I agree with Brad that a flight yoke and rudder pedal system makes for a more pleasant experience for the patrons.  About my monitors.  I use triple monitors on my system for the immersion factor.  I can view the entire front window and left side window without turning my head.  Alternately, the center monitor could hold the simulator, while navigation maps could be displayed on the other monitors.  You would need a video card capable of displaying to three monitors.  The monitors should be identical to each other.  Mine are 42" Vizio LED type displays.  They run cool and are economical to use.  (rated at $13/yr electrical consumption each, I think).  I'd like to also mention my trim wheel accessory.  The trim wheel controls the fine tuning of the vertical movement in your plane.  Flying level is much easier to accomplish using one.
     I was wondering if the museum would be staffing the display?  That may keep users "in" the simulator, not surfing the web.  Just a thought.

Jeff

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ualani

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Re: Advice On Setting Up A Flight Simulator in a Public Space
« Reply #3 on: December 17, 2019, 11:50:44 PM »
My first question would be what is your budget? You can sink a considerable amount of money into this in a pretty big hurry.

Steve
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KetchikanMuseumsAK

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Re: Advice On Setting Up A Flight Simulator in a Public Space
« Reply #4 on: December 19, 2019, 09:27:41 PM »

     I was wondering if the museum would be staffing the display?  That may keep users "in" the simulator, not surfing the web.  Just a thought.

Thats one of the logistics problems that I am trying to workshop before we go live with it. I need to be able to lock the interface so that patrons can't navigate away from the flight simulator. While it would be located near the visitor services area we dont have the staffing to have someone directly facilitating the simulator.

 We have been throwing around the 3-monitor set up to help with the immersion part of the experience.. We'd seen a couple set ups with additional fabrication to make it look like you were looking through the windshield to the displays, so thats in the wishlist set up/draft.

Thank you for the running info for your own multi-monitor set up!

KetchikanMuseumsAK

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Re: Advice On Setting Up A Flight Simulator in a Public Space
« Reply #5 on: December 19, 2019, 09:38:46 PM »
I've personally been fortunate enough to take a real flight with a small operator out of Ketchikan. Alaska Seaplanes met us on the dock and took us on a flight around the Misty Fjords area on a crystal clear blue day a couple of years ago. My wife and I were there on a cruise and had enough time to get a sight seeing flight in. 

So glad you got to visit and got to enjoy a Misty Fjords trip, that is some unreal scenery for sure, and one of the reasons we thought that a flight simulator of some of those same routes/features might be worthwhile for those stuck on the ground during their visit to Ketchikan.

A Flight Yoke and even Rudder pedals would definitely make things feel more real. ... Not very difficult to get up and running though.

How sturdy would you say the CH equipment is?? I know that the simulator and any plugins are going to take a beating, but we really dont have it in the budget to have too much pre-purchased if we need multiple backups.. I had some sticker shock looking at the Precision Flight Controls from full blown flight simulators...

KetchikanMuseumsAK

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Re: Advice On Setting Up A Flight Simulator in a Public Space
« Reply #6 on: December 19, 2019, 09:51:45 PM »
My first question would be what is your budget? You can sink a considerable amount of money into this in a pretty big hurry.

Steve, just in looking at some of the equipment that folks like the Air and Space Museum/Flight Schools use was enough of a sticker shock for me in looking into things, so I can see how thing can balloon fast.

We have around $400-600 that can be used just on the hardware/software/fabrication of the sim.

We already have and wouldnt need to buy a dedicated and functional (more than exceeds minimum running requirements) computer for running the flight sim and can borrow additional monitors as we need them, the accessories and the hardiness of pedals/yolks ect is one point of concern, as is the ability to figure out a way to initialize the flight simulator and (program it?) have it restart in the harbor after each crash/restart.

I guess one of the real questions is how is the learning curve on using the simulator for the average person without too much additional instruction/walkthrough help?

One of the other ideas we have been kick around its to also get a couple pilots to mount GoPros and film their takeoffs/landings and simulate a cockpit for folks to enjoy, but that is much less hands-on then a flight sim they can pilot

In any case thank you for the advice!!


jeff3163

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Re: Advice On Setting Up A Flight Simulator in a Public Space
« Reply #7 on: December 20, 2019, 12:33:22 AM »
I just wanted to mention that I use "Wheel Stand Pro" to hold my flight yoke, trim wheel, and rudder pedals.  I highly recommend them.  I bought two.  The other one is for my G27 steering wheel setup for driving sims.

 8) https://www.wheelstandpro.com/

Quote
I guess one of the real questions is how is the learning curve on using the simulator for the average person without too much additional instruction/walkthrough help?

     The learning curve is different for each aircraft.  Are they flying Ultra-lites or DHC-2 Beavers?     Wheels or floats.  Taking off and landing the plane, or just starting the flight in the air?

     I like the idea of them just sitting and watching a video of someone else flying the tour better.   ;)
« Last Edit: December 20, 2019, 12:51:32 AM by jeff3163 »

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Bradallen43

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Re: Advice On Setting Up A Flight Simulator in a Public Space
« Reply #8 on: December 20, 2019, 07:04:35 AM »
I think that it's going to be hard for you to maintain any control of a simulator like Flight Simulator X or Prepar3D, which is what we use, without having a knowledgeable and dedicated team member present and on hand to set up the simulator scenario, get the flight loaded, get the user up in the air and back on the ground. This platform doesn't really work automatically that way.

 It takes selections from the end user to load a given scenario or saved flight. That flight aspect can be created and saved in the simulator but somebody still has to know where the menu in the user interface is to load that flight option, select it and launch the saved flight. Then you'll have to tell the user what to do. "Move the Throttle with this lever", "Keep the aircraft pointing in that direction on the ground or water by using the rudder pedals", "Raise the Landing Gear with that button", etc.

I know this is a paradigm shift from your idea of using the simulator like we do here at home but without having somebody that can assist the users, it will be difficult for those that are unfamiliar with the software platforms to know what to do without any guidance or supervision. They will have no clue how to make things operate.

 My suggestion is that you create and make a video demonstration using software or video footage that can produce a quick flight of the area. It can loop and repeat and then you can have visitors come into the exhibit area, sit down and enjoy a video flight around Tongass Narrows and the surrounding area. They can come and go as they please in the viewing area you create and enjoy the view while a virtual pilot flies them around the area.

 GoPro cameras that are in use today can create some breathtaking video. Here's one I just located online that can give you an example of the footage I'd want to see in a video of a Misty Fjords flight.
 


A video like this would give the visitors a first hand look at what flying on and over the water, mountains and down low around the Misty Fjords is like. This presentation could be edited to show the take off portion, highlights of the in flight scenery of the area and then landing back in Ketchikan. Maybe a 10 to 20 minute experience.

 Another idea is using Virtual Reality headsets. But you would need to purchase several that can show any flight videos of the area. VR Headsets are also a component favored by some of our users but those are expensive too. They can be set up and run with FSX and P3D but again, then you'll need to have a staff member onsite as well that will maintain them. They should be cleaned before given to each user to not spread any nasty stuff. The cost associated with that, the hardware etc. That can also get pricey in a hurry.

 As a current worker in the field of A/V, we have seen more usage of VR presentations on trade show floors by exhibitors where VR Headsets are handed out to exhibit patrons to view a video demonstration of a product, etc. But each of those demonstrations needs and uses dedicated worker/s who are only there at the exhibit to assist, operate and manipulate the software. Then clean, set-up and adjust the VR headsets for the visitors. They start the presentation, troubleshoot if it's not working, remove the headset, remove the protective eye covers or ear pieces, clean and make ready for the next person in line. It's a labor intensive process.

 I think a well produced video of Misty Fjords, like the example one I shared above, would give visitors a good idea of what the surrounding area looks like. Those who can't actually take a flight seeing adventure in the area would then be able to see how beautiful it looks out there from the air.

 The cost associated would be for the aerial video production. The flight operator of course will be a cost consideration but many use video equipment on their flights and could provide the scenery shots you're looking for. You might even be able to work out a deal with a local flight operator that will provide the footage for you if you provide a sponsorship agreement where they get references to their flight operations or literature at the museum. Just another suggestion of course.
 
 Brad

Penzoil3

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Re: Advice On Setting Up A Flight Simulator in a Public Space
« Reply #9 on: December 20, 2019, 06:11:08 PM »
 8) What about Kiosk mode ?
"Look in the main FSX folder. There is a Kiosk.exe and a document file that explains how to use it."

KetchikanMuseumsAK

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Re: Advice On Setting Up A Flight Simulator in a Public Space
« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2019, 08:53:23 PM »

 As a current worker in the field of A/V, we have seen more usage of VR presentations on trade show floors by exhibitors where VR Headsets are handed out to exhibit patrons to view a video demonstration of a product, etc. But each of those demonstrations needs and uses dedicated worker/s who are only there at the exhibit to assist, operate and manipulate the software.

I'm a fan of things like the oculus but you are totally spot on when it comes to having to directly supervise (and sanitize equipment) between users.

Lots of good sound advice Brad, many thanks! We might end up only using the flight simulator for scheduled school visits and open house museum family fun days so that we can directly supervise folks.

If you havent had a chance to check out the videography of the Bush Pilots segment of the Ketchikan Story Project its totally worth a gander: https://vimeopro.com/ebenandelle/the-ketchikan-story-project/video/79908357


KetchikanMuseumsAK

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Re: Advice On Setting Up A Flight Simulator in a Public Space
« Reply #11 on: December 20, 2019, 08:57:41 PM »
8) What about Kiosk mode ?
"Look in the main FSX folder. There is a Kiosk.exe and a document file that explains how to use it."

Huzahhh! That is very much what I am after too. I think a combination of instructing hands on when we have the staffing/are actively using the flight sim and a passive display might end up being what we go with.

Thanks!