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Return to Misty Moorings (FSX/P3D/MSFS2020) => Addon Scenery and Enhancements => Topic started by: rgerdes on February 21, 2019, 02:34:16 PM

Title: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: rgerdes on February 21, 2019, 02:34:16 PM
Installed the refreshed Bettles and see several cars and trucks missing their wheels and two buildings without textures.
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: av8erjm on March 12, 2019, 02:18:11 PM
I'm having the same issue I even went back and reloaded the object libraries required to no avail. Maybe one of the scenery Guru's can tell us what we are doing wrong
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: nbrich1 on March 12, 2019, 04:02:13 PM
Not exactly a scenery guru but do know that there is a fix for wheels.

There is P3Dvxx Land Vehicle Fix - For P3Dvxx. if wheels missing on vehicles, this is the fix file.
(by RTMM Rod Jackson)

Page Link: http://return.mistymoorings.com/getting_started/index.php#10

File download Link:
http://return.mistymoorings.com/scenery/P3D%20Scenery%20Fix/P3Dv2%20Land%20Vehicle%20Fix.zip
-----------------------------------

How to: Go to Scenery\Global\Scenery Folder and add the suffix .off to the vehicles_land.bgl file you find there and then copy the fix vehicles_landFSXP3D.BGL  from this folder to that very same ...P3Dxx\Scenery\Global\Scenery Folder.

This converted file contains all the same models that the incorrectly working vehicles_land.bgl file contained except that now they have been re-converted to work correctly in P3Dxx.

Give it a shot. Hopefully this will fix up your flat tires but for the black textures, and make sure your libs were updated with LIB Part IV (Which also had updates to previous parts. (Also a good idea to make sure your display driver is up to date and that your control panel setting (IE Nvidia) matches your sim AA settings.


Norm

Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 12, 2019, 06:46:30 PM
Are you also missing the textures that the OP is missing? ?

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: av8erjm on March 12, 2019, 07:24:38 PM
ualani, I'm missing the two cabin texture shown in rgerdes pic I'm in FSX and like I said I've down loaded the object folders listed but I guess I'm missing one or something All the vehicles have their wheels n' tires for me though
 
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 13, 2019, 12:06:24 AM
Both buildings are actually the same object.
The textures used for this object are:

nac_airfield_shed.dds
nac_airfield_shed_lm.dds
nac_lumber_dgray.dds
nac_roof_ceramic_old.dds

The shed object is located in RTMMTwo Object LibraryFSXP3D\scenery
The specific library is FSXP3D nac_objects.bgl
The textures are located in the texture sub folder

Search your system for the above textures. If you find more than one instance of them, then post back and tell me where they are located.

Steve


Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: rgerdes on March 13, 2019, 01:48:00 PM
Well, I got the texture and missing auto wheel problem fixed, but It looks like I'm missing the building that goes over the isolated chimneys in my above photo.
Can you tell me where that object is located please?
Thanks,
Bob
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: av8erjm on March 13, 2019, 03:26:00 PM
Did a search for those 4 textures and have them in two folders the '' NAC bases library'' and the ''RTMM required FSX3D libraries Part IV
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 13, 2019, 06:19:27 PM
Thank you for alerting me to this. Remove them from one of those libraries and see what happens, preferably from the Part IV Library.

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: av8erjm on March 13, 2019, 07:15:58 PM
One quick question, should I delete the whole NAC library folder, seems like a lot of redundancy  by delete I mean from the scenery log in FSX, not the actual folder in the FSX/addon scenery/NAC Library
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 13, 2019, 08:41:40 PM
No. Just delete the .dds textures that I listed above from the Part IV library's texture folder.

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: av8erjm on March 13, 2019, 10:55:07 PM
OK thanks will do just gitin ready to nod off, I'll get back on the morrow
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 13, 2019, 11:45:55 PM
Bob,
The building that you're missing that has the smoking chimneys is called "agn_farmbunkhouse_1. It's from  from autogen.bgl, which is a stock library (.bgl) that comes with FSX/P3D. You should have that library bgl in scenery\global\scenery. If it isn't there, post back.

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: rgerdes on March 14, 2019, 12:21:35 AM
Hi Ualani,
Checked and I do have the "autogen.bgl" in scenery/global/scenery but for some reason the "agn_farmbunkhouse_1" is not showing at bettles.
The autogen.bgl is dated 5/24/2017.
Thanks,
Bob
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: jeff3163 on March 14, 2019, 12:49:21 AM
This is the result when I search my system for that file ...  ???

I have no copy of it in any of my sim locations, just the SDKs autogen renders folders.   :-\

(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m531/jeff3163/MOON/Flight%20Simulator%20X%20Files/2019/agn_farmbunkhouse_1%20on%20my%20system.png)
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 14, 2019, 07:47:04 AM
Bob,
The date of my autogen.bgl is 9/26/2007, and is 15853kb. Are you using FSX or P3D? Also, look and see if you have another autogen.bgl on your system other than in scenery\global\scenery. (By the way, I'm an FSX user, so the bgl dates may be different because of that.)

Jeff,
I don't know what to tell you. Your screenshot shows the right GUID# for the object in question. Is autogen.bgl in your scenery\global\scenery folder? Does the building object show up for you at Bettles?

Is anyone else missing this building or have missing textures issues? I'm not 100% positive, but I think Brad created the RTMM location, and put it around either an ORBX or a stock airport.

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: Dieter on March 14, 2019, 09:38:13 AM
I just visited Bettles/PABT. Everything looks like it should (I suppose)
This is P3Dv4.4
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: jeff3163 on March 14, 2019, 10:12:11 AM
     I was missing both of the textures for NAC_airfield_shed and the NAC_roof_ceramic_old as well.  I copied them from other places on my system into the texture folder and now they show correctly.  My agn_farmbunkhouse_1 was showing for me already.   8)

     I seem to have two installs of this scenery, because I turned Bettles off in my scenery library, and it still shows.  I turned it off because I noticed the waving guy had two sets of arms, now with it off is only one guy.  I can't find the copy yet.  Will search for it after work.   ;)
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 14, 2019, 10:33:43 AM
Thanks Dieter.

Jeff,
Those textures are included with the Part IV library. If you have that library installed, you should have had them there.

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 14, 2019, 10:36:48 AM
Dieter,
It looks like you have some kind of crazy, out of place autogen tile near the big oil tank like I do. I thought it was something goofy on my system, but apparently not.

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: Dieter on March 14, 2019, 11:44:07 AM
I deactivated scenery \Bettles Lodge and "RTMM SDT PABT Bettles.bgl" from Snow Dogs Tour to see what happens.
This strange autogen tile is still there. So we have to live with that.
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 14, 2019, 12:05:20 PM
Must be something in vector, I guess.

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: av8erjm on March 14, 2019, 01:02:05 PM
Steve I took the four texture files out of the part iv and everything is in place and as it should be. Now then I went to the three NAC strip Kispiox, Randolph Peak and Sharp Cone to see if it disturbed anything there and had a leaning tower of Piazza at each  strip, when I disallowed the part IV in the scenery list it went away I posted a pic of it Also in slewing around Kisipox the sign over the entrance to the strip has no texture, whether I allow or disallowed part IV The game of whack a mole continues I really don't think my sceneries like the part IV
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: av8erjm on March 14, 2019, 01:23:05 PM
and a pic of the welcome sign at Kispiox
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 14, 2019, 02:22:20 PM
It's hard for me to see the coordinates in your screenshots, so please post them for me. I'll have a gander when I know exactly where to look without searching around.

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: rgerdes on March 14, 2019, 02:23:56 PM
Question for Dieter:
Did you install the P3Dv4.4 content also?
Reason I ask is I decided to reinstall the 4.4 client to see if I had the missing building.
Viola, the building was there, but then noticed I had screwed up and installed the 4.3 client by mistake - when I installed the 4.4 client (I never installed the 4.4 content) and the building is missing again...
So guess the content is needed also?
Anyway, think I'll wait for 4.5 or 5.0 - Bettles isn't that important to me.. :)
Bob
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: Dieter on March 14, 2019, 02:48:36 PM
Yes I did both:
1. Uninstalled Academic client (4.3)
2. Installed new Academic Client (4.4)
3. Uninstalled Academic Content (4.3)
4. Installed Academic Content (4.4)
Run the installation from the complete unpacked 4.4 version as the . msi installers need other files from the package.

That's done in 5 minutes.

To your problem:
You are using only the new refreshed RTMM scenery files?
Important: did you really delete all former old RTMM installation stuff.
I was wondering you were talking about  a "NAC Library" in one of your postings below. This doesn't exist anymore.
You should also renew all your RTMM libraries and add the new one (RTMM Required FSXP3D Libraries Part IV)
Don't forget to activate every scenery and library folder in scenery.cfg.
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: rgerdes on March 14, 2019, 04:40:23 PM
Hi Dieter.
That "FSXP3D nac_library.bgl"
 is found in RTMMTwo Object LibraryFSXP3D
Is it not needed?
Bob
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: av8erjm on March 14, 2019, 04:50:27 PM
Steve on the first pic us Lat N55* 27.48' Lon W127* 44.64' MAG135 on the second try Lat N55* 27.43' Lon 127* 44.48' Mag 270
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 14, 2019, 05:05:45 PM
OK, I'm having some of the same issues you are at Kispoix with the textures and leaning tower. The leaning tower is a windsock, that when you slew closer to it, the tower disappears. when you get there, it's just hanging in mid air with no pole supporting it. I'm trying to figure out the texture issue and it might take some time because I can't understand what's going on at the moment. Working on it, but due to the time I have right now, it may take me a day or 2 to have an answer - or not!

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: av8erjm on March 14, 2019, 06:19:08 PM
Steve no rush I just thought I'd call it to your attention, I for one appreciate all you and all the other scenery designers accomplish I wouldn't know the first thing to do and probably wouldn't understand it if you told me
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 15, 2019, 01:13:01 AM
Does anyone else have the same issues at Kispoix with a "leaning tower" or missing textures. I have an idea about what's causing the leaning tower problem, but can't quite get it fixed properly.

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: Dieter on March 15, 2019, 04:55:56 AM
That "FSXP3D nac_library.bgl"
 is found in RTMMTwo Object LibraryFSXP3D
Is it not needed?
.......................
Yes, of course, still needed, was a misunderstanding!
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: Dieter on March 15, 2019, 05:32:48 AM
Well, I cannot confirm these problems:
- FSX
There are two moving windsocks, red-white striped, one at the ryw end at the fence (==> that's what you see as "leaning tower"), one at the "Welcome" sign.
No any other missing objects, welcome sign ok

- P3D
no problems at all
Attention: to get the windsocks in P3D users must change the "nack_kispiox_windsock.bgl" file from the \NAC Kispiox River folder against the one in \NAC_Kispiox River_WS_P3D folder with same name.
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 15, 2019, 08:53:57 AM
As I mentioned I have the same issue with the windsocks looking like leaning columns from a distance. When approaching either one of them the windsocks appear as they should. Anyone else see any abnormalities? Does the windsock just hang in the air without a pole holding it up?
 
Technical stuff:

LOD = Level Of Detail.

In examining the windsock object, for some reason that I don't understand, the object creator assigned 3 LOD values, so that when viewed from a distance the windsock looks like a column. (Generally speaking, LOD values are assigned to more complex objects that don't need to be fully drawn when viewed at a distance in order to save GPU resources. It can actually appear as just a cube in the far distance, but it doesn't matter because you can't distinguish an details anyway. Like looking at a tree that's far away. You can't see the detail of the bark or even distinguish individual leaves, but as you approach it, the details of the tree become more and more distinguishable.  Same concept with LOD values assigned to objects so that when viewed from a distance the object is supposed to look like a nondescript polygon, and as you get closer to it, the details begin to fill in. I have no idea why such a very simple object, which consumes little resources, would require anything but the default LOD value.)

When attempting to examine the object's LOD properties in MCX and then change the LOD values, it causes MCX to crash due to an invalid value somewhere in the object. Therefore, there's something wrong with the object that's causing display problems for some of us. My inclination right now is to delete the windsock from the scenery. Still working on texture issues.

Steve

EDIT: I was able to find a workaround to change the LOD values in the windsock to make it display without looking like a leaning tower from a distance. It requires changing the specific object, changing it in the Part IV library, and thus requiring everyone to re-download the entire library. Not going to do it. See my workable fix at http://forum.mistymoorings.com/index.php?topic=4326.msg37712#msg37712
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: rgerdes on March 15, 2019, 04:46:33 PM
Finally got the building to show  8) - didn't have to add the content for 4.4 either......
MCX worked.
Bob
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 19, 2019, 07:20:27 PM
. No matter what I tried, the windsock at Kospoix just doesn't display right for me unless I'm fairly close to it and then it pops in. There's definitely a problem with the windsock model as I alluded to previously. Why it works for some and not for others is a mystery to me. So, as a work around for FSX users having the "leaning tower" problem, copy nack_kispiox_windsock.bgl, found in the NAC_Kispiox River_WS_P3D folder to NAC Kispiox River\scenery and overwrite.

I also had the missing textures problem, which is usually caused by duplicate textures or bgl's elsewhere on your system. In my case, I don't have any duplicates and still have non-displaying textures - even though they are right in the texture folder. The only solution I could get to fix the problem was the old "copy the pesky textures to the main texture folder," and it fixed it.

The textures to copy from RTMM Required  FSXP3D Libraries Part IV_2.11.19\Texture to the main texture folder are:
nac_door_kispiox_river.dds
nac_board_ksc.dds

At this point I don't have the time to do anymore troubleshooting on this and am just accepting the workarounds as "good enough" solutions.


Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: av8erjm on March 19, 2019, 10:27:43 PM
A for effort Steve I'll look for the two texture files and put them where you say as for the other problem I'll just remove the part iv from the scenery config page, Again thanks for the try
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 19, 2019, 10:35:05 PM
Don't remove or disable the Part IV libraries! You need them. Just copy those textures and bgl files the way I instructed.
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: Bradallen43 on March 20, 2019, 08:10:59 AM
Steve,

Okay this is strange but I have faith that we'll find a solution.

 I also have the two buildings at Bettles not showing textures like the OP showed. I did as suggested but the textures still do not show. I only have one file on my system for each of the four nac texture files you discovered for this building. So no duplicates on those but still showing up black with no textures.

However, there are quite a few other duplicate nac library texture files that I discovered. These are in the texture folders of two required RTMM object libraries installed on my system.

Look inside your RTMMTwo Object LibraryFSXP3D\Texture folder and FSXP3D RTMM Libraries Part IV_2.11.19\Texture folder and see if you are also showing duplicates.

Some examples of duplicates of nac textures:

nac_base_1.dds
nac_base_1_lm.dds
nac_base_2.dds
nac_base_2_lm.dds
nac_base_3.dds
nac_base_3_lm.dds
nac_base_4.dds
nac_base_4_lm.dds
nac_base_5.dds
nac_base_5_lm.dds
nac_base_6.dds
nac_base_6_lm.dds
nac_base_7.dds
nac_base_7_lm.dds
nac_base_8.dds
nac_base_8_lm.dds
nac_bb_sharp_cone.dds
nac_bb_welcome.dds
nac_bb_wood.dds

and several others. Please look and see if you're also seeing duplicates inside these two texture folders like I am. Maybe this is why the NAC object is showing on my system as black?

Brad
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: Dieter on March 20, 2019, 09:15:01 AM
I confirm that the named files and some others nac_xxxx files are duplicate in
RTMMTwo Object LibraryFSXP3D\Texture folder and FSXP3D RTMM Libraries Part IV_2.11.19\Texture.
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 20, 2019, 10:04:02 AM
Brad,
This forum topic actually evolved into 2 separate issues: Bettles and NAC, which may be a little confusing.

Bettles issue:
So, to confirm, you have the following in RTMMTwo Object LibraryFSXP3D\textures, and you copied them to the main texture folder, correct?

nac_airfield_shed.dds
nac_airfield_shed_lm.dds
nac_lumber_dgray.dds
nac_roof_ceramic_old.dds

These are the required textures for those buildings. Since they show up nowhere else on your system, I can't figure out what your issue might be. The buildings display fine for me and others. The OP solved his texture problem, but didn't really say what he did. I don't know if he moved them to the main texture folder or not as a fix.

Not being a P3D user, I've read where clearing your cache and reloading can sometime fix some weird display problems, but I can't confirm this myself. Doug has mentioned this numerous times as well. It would be helpful to know what others see at Bettles, so if anyone else can chime in I'd really appreciate it!

NAC scenery issues:
The duplicate textures you list don't include the ones that I listed above, so there can't be any interference. That being said in order to keep from having duplicate textures hanging around in several places, I'll take a look at things and perhaps redo the Part IV library, remove any duplicates, and reissue it in order to eliminate any confusion or issues that might crop up in the future.

I also should add that anyone who had any of the NAC sceneries installed on before I issued the Part IV library, then they would already have had the textures that you listed on their systems anyway. Food for thought.

I'll keep everyone posted on this, and in the meantime, if someone else can confirm the P3D cache thing, or is having the same missing texture issues, I'd appreciate hearing about it here.

Steve

 


Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: Bradallen43 on March 20, 2019, 11:19:16 AM
Steve,

I’ll try moving those four textures to the main texture folder and report back.

Thanks fo all you do,

Brad
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 20, 2019, 12:23:22 PM
I've sent Doug a new Part IV library to put up. I've removed the duplicate textures that are also contained in the RTMMTwo Object Library. He should have it up sometime today, 3/20/19.

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: nbrich1 on March 20, 2019, 12:28:45 PM
When adding or removing scenery, (or when changing/updating GPU drivers), in P3Dv4x best to delete the shader cache folder located in hidden folder:

(C:\Users\yourname\AppData\Local\Lockheed Martin\Prepar3D v4\Shaders)

and as well as the sceneryindexes_x64 folder: located in hidden folder:

C:\ProgramData\Lockheed Martin\Prepar3D v4\SceneryIndexes_x64


P3Dv4x will rebuild/configure/optimize new folders for each and shader files as well as new sceneryindexesx64 for your installed scenery and set up upon restart.

Norm
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: Bradallen43 on March 20, 2019, 04:54:55 PM
Thanks for this update Steve,

Okay I'm going to install the updated library now and will report back. One thing I did notice before I go further is after unzipping this latest update on my system, I noticed that the sub-folder inside RTMM Libraries Part IV's latest update includes a date of 2.11.19 ??

Might want to change that as well to avoid confusion moving forward.

Brad

Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: Bradallen43 on March 20, 2019, 05:58:58 PM
Excellent. I have the building showing as designed now.

Thank you Steve. Maybe the duplicates were causing an issue afterall?

Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 20, 2019, 08:54:40 PM
There was a problem or 2 in the Part IV library that I had Doug put up today. There's a new/new Part IV Library you need to grab. Sorry.

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: av8erjm on March 20, 2019, 11:39:13 PM
Sorry if I confused the two, but in using FSX I found Part IV to be a problem for my using it from the floating buildings  ETC at PAKT to others. Not trying lay blame, just reflections from my point of view
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: ualani on March 21, 2019, 06:54:56 AM
The Part IV library absolutely can have nothing to do with floating buildings. All it did was consolidate objects, textures and effects that were scattered around in a handful of miscellaneous RTMM scenery files. Make sure that you download the revised scenery that is listed in the Part IV readme. The newest release of the Part IV library cleans up some duplicate textures, that you helped us to identify, were already in another RTMM library. If you have floating buildings at PAKT then you should do a search for the solution which was addressed many, many moons ago. Please post screenshots of your problems so we can help you solve them. That's what we're here for.

Steve
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: stiletto2 on March 21, 2019, 10:44:00 AM
Also, keep in mind that occasional floating buildings (autogen) is a known bug in FSX.  It is random.  Here is an excerpt from a Holger Sandmann post that talks about it:

The floating autogen houses are an unfortunate bug of FSX, or rather a side effect of how it loads terrain mesh and places autogen on it.

While flying in FSX the landscape components at mid to far distances are not loaded in full detail but rather at lower-resolution versions, often referred to as LODs or Level of Detail. Think of it as concentric rings of decreasing detail moving along with your aircraft. It's a common approach in games to keep frame rates at acceptable levels.

These lower-detail versions of data include the terrain mesh. Autogen trees and buildings are placed directly on top of this terrain, again a certain distance from the user aircraft (visible as the "popping-up" effect), and their elevation is fixed once placed. In mountainous terrain, especially in narrow valleys like at Skagway, the lower-detail terrain may have significantly different elevations than the highest-detail version. Thus, if the autogen gets placed while the lower-detail version is still being displayed then the autogen ends up in the air when the higher-detail terrain mesh replaces the lower-detail version. It's much more pronounced for buildings than trees because houses are placed in larger groups.

Unfortunately, there's no known fix for this, though perhaps choosing a LOD_RADIUS= parameter value in the fsx.cfg file may help with loading the higher-detail mesh sooner (I haven't tested this myself). A work-around is to refresh the scenery when you see floating buildings (you can set a key combination for that in the FSX Controls menu) but that is, of course, not a very satisfying solution.
In any case, any location with significant local terrain gradients is likely to suffer from this issue, anywhere on the FSX planet.


Rod
Title: Re: Refreshed Bettles
Post by: av8erjm on March 21, 2019, 02:05:57 PM
Well speaking for myself, the ''new improved'' Part IV is working great, Thank you to all involved, drinks are on me at Misty's