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Return to Misty Moorings (FSX/P3D) => The Moorings - On the Water => Topic started by: jeff3163 on March 09, 2011, 01:15:13 AM

Title: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 09, 2011, 01:15:13 AM
I installed a few Nav/GPS buttons in my Malibu to see which mode I'm in.  I like it, so I thought I'd share.  The following sections are for the Deltasim Malibu, in the panel.cfg file:

Pick one you like, or use them all.
//--------------------------------------------------------
[Window00]
Background_color=0,0,0
size_mm=1024
position=8
visible=0
ident=MAIN_PANEL
                                                                                     //Note there wasn't anything in this panel originally.
gauge00=Beech_Baron!Nav GPS Switch, 512,984,40,40  // Puts switch in bottom center of window.  Use
                                                                                      // shift+1 to display it.

//--------------------------------------------------------
[Window01]
Background_color=2,2,2
size_mm=156,308
window_size_ratio=1.000 
position=8
visible=0
ident=RADIO_STACK_PANEL
window_size= 0.244, 0.642
window_pos= 0.756, 0.358

gauge00=Bendix_King_Radio!Bendix-King Radio Audio,  0,0,156
gauge01=Bendix_King_Radio!Bendix-King Radio Nav-Comm 1,  0,29,156
gauge02=Bendix_King_Radio!Bendix-King Radio Nav-Comm 2,  0,86,156
gauge03=Bendix_King_Radio!Bendix-King Radio ADF,  0,142,156
gauge04=Bendix_King_Radio!Bendix-King Radio DME,  0,180,156
gauge05=Bendix_King_Radio!Bendix-King Radio Xpndr,  0,217,156
gauge06=Bendix_King_Radio!Bendix-King Radio AP,  0,262,156
gauge07=Beech_Baron!Nav GPS Switch, 0,262,20,20  // Puts switch in upper left corner of AP radio.
                                                                                  // (at bottom of radio stack)

//----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

edit - (I've removed the switch over the compass, in the VC, because it was ugly and redundant.  The one on the radio stack is pretty cool though.)

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 09, 2011, 07:25:16 AM
Jeff, does the gps/nav make a difference in the boat's tracking a plan?  I thought this would be the key, that the stack was set on "nav" and you needed it switched to "gps" (that's why the switch is added to the beaver).

Another question I've got ... does anybody know what makes the "water rudders" kick in in an amphibian. (Ctrl-W).  Is there something we can add to the aircraft.cfg to add water rudders to the boats. That would keep them from "sliding" and might actually help them track on a gps turn.

Doug
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 09, 2011, 10:03:46 AM
It should be on "GPS".  I am working on the water rudder thing.  Nothing conclusive yet.  I'll get back to you on that one. 
I put my mug on this can of soda, to see if I could. 


(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m531/jeff3163/MOON/Flight%20Simulator%20X%20Files/2011/fsx2011-03-0906-45-37-70.jpg~original)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 11, 2011, 12:27:46 AM
I am finding that using autorudder (ctrl+shift+U) while in autopilot helps the boats turn better.

Edit:  Disregard this, as a better solution has been discovered since this post.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 12, 2011, 12:41:25 PM
Nice airboat, Dieter.  I like it. 

(But, maybe they should be in the screenshot gallery, though, as I was wanting to use this thread to deal with the "configuration" of the boats' aircraft.cfg and panel.cfg files.)

Quote
For using the GPS you have to activate "Avionics" via a given key or load the default MS C-172 before.

  There seems to be alot more to do than that.  ( I tried both of those suggestions, but no positive results came from doing it.  Avionics is active, btw.)  The problem is that the boats steer via the rudder, a plane steers via the ailerons.  How to switch this rule?  That is the question.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 12, 2011, 12:51:55 PM
I've posted a video showing my progress so far.  Well, the video doesn't do justice to all the tweaking I've done, but it shows the boat tracking the GPS signal, and following the path.  There's a part where the route goes over a little island.  I had to swerve to avoid the island, and the AP brought me back in line.  Always run boats with the "autorudder" activated (ctrl+shift+U), even if you have rudder pedals.  The AP turns much better that way.  Watch video in HD, full screen, to be able to read the GPS better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9NK2e3a-SM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9NK2e3a-SM)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 12, 2011, 10:58:22 PM
I just put water rudders on my Malibu.  I've got to go for a test run, and dial them in.  But they're on the boat, and it's still riding in the water ok.  No spinning out of control, yet.  ;D

The new water rudder switch is accessed with shift+1.  It's right next to the Nav/GPS switch.  The water rudder switch won't show up if no water rudders are on the boat.  As soon as I installed the water rudder's lines into the cfg file and reloaded the boat, the switch showed up. 
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 13, 2011, 09:40:37 AM
Jeff ... you are getting closer!  I've been navigating with the top down window open in an undocked window. I have it set for the boat's heading (not north up). Make it about 1/3 of the screen high, maybe 2" wide and put it down in the left corner.  If we put a Heading Guage, your switches, an on/off for heading, and just the small gps, we'd have a heck of a boat navigation panel.  I'm playing with that aspect of this.  The boat is centered in that window. So half the screen (behind you) you don't care about ... you've "been there."  So if we put the gauges in the bottom half it wouldn't interfere with the the function of the top down. This would work for blue water and for river runs.

The top down view is invaluable in Misty. There are islands that come at you that have no land above the water line, you don't see them until you are on them. But if you are looking in top down, all of these show beautifully. (Plan-G and the FSX Map) don't see these and neither are picking up the new PFJ landscape).  I'm finding, even without autopilot, it is a lot of fun to follow a gps course that misses the obstructions. You can see them coming with the top down, etc.

NOTAM If we've got any "panel people" out there, we're open to help and hints on the above. What would be nice is a simple wooden panel on the bottom 1/3 of that window (letting the top down view work behind it) and the gauges on that pane. Pull it up from the "instruments" view and we're all set.

Doug
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 13, 2011, 03:59:59 PM
Eureka!!  I've done it.  I found this link on the web, the key I'd been searching for.  I now have a working boat AP.  I'm posting updated cfg files.  They have been re-worked, and cleaned up some. 
     There is a variable I found, to "Link the ailerons to the rudders".  That is what I needed.  Now steering is done with the steering wheel, like a real boat.  They don't have pedals.  It also maps the autopilot to the rudder, instead of the ailerons.  Careful with the steering, it is kinda touchy, but is very nice.  I may be able to soften it up a bit, but don't want to lose the beautiful tracking.  Don't freak out because your rudder pedals don't work, they are disabled in the cfg file.  You'll get 'em back when you switch to a plane.
     I removed the Nav/GPS switch from the compass, as it didn't really function well.  The radio stack, and panel switches are perfect for the job.  I don't think we need to mess with a wooden panel look. The panel window, as I have it, is transparent and less invasive to the screen.  The switches are at the bottom center.
    I'm sending the cfg files now, so you can try it out.

-edit-  I installed a default C208 water rudder switch.  Everyone should have one of those in their gauges folder.

If I've missed anything, let me know. 

Bookmark this link into your browser, for a quick reference while editing your cfg files. ;)
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc526949.aspx#mozTocId942782 (http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc526949.aspx#mozTocId942782)

Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 13, 2011, 04:10:55 PM
Great find ... a step at a time, you're getting there.  Can't get the radio stack to turn on, will this track autopilot better?  Also didn't see the cab files, just 2 configs in the zipper?

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 13, 2011, 05:01:04 PM
Great find ... a step at a time, you're getting there.  Can't get the radio stack to turn on, will this track autopilot better?  Also didn't see the cab files, just 2 configs in the zipper?

D
Quote
I'm removing the CAB file, looking for a native rendition.  Sending the cfg files now, so you can try it out.

     Sorry about that.  I had to remove the cab file because it was too large for a post.  I, or someone, needs to find a water rudder switch from a default fsx plane.  So that everyone will already have that switch in their systems.  The one I have is from a floatplane called Flight_Design_CTSW_C-IMCT.  It's a cute little single seater, freeware too.  I found this in its readme file:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Flight Design CTsw Light Sport Aircraft on Floats - Full Package for FSX

The Flight Design CT is the performance leader in Light Sport Aircraft due to its remarkable design and high-tech construction. The carbon fiber and Kevlar composite airframe allows for a very strong, light and aerodynamically clean design. The unique fuselage design of the CT minimizes drag and maximizes interior room for you and your luggage.

All new FSDS2 & 3 design as of 15 Oct, 2007
Copyright 2007 by Premier Aircraft Design

Barry Blaisdell
Jean-Pierre Brisard
Bob May
Kevin Pardy
Danny Crance
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

It says it's illegal for me to distribute the gauge file without permission, but people can get the plane themselves. 

I think the best solution is to come up with a switch that everyone already has.  We don't really "need" the switch though.  I think it'll work without a switch.  But we will have one.


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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 14, 2011, 11:09:34 PM
Messing with the "panel" on the Malibu ... just learning how to position things, etc.  This configuration works for me ... on the right is a top down, you can see the islands coming.  There is a gps/nav switch on the lower part of the radio stack (autopilot part).  I can also switch to heading, and control it by tweaking the heading gauge above right of the little cluster.  I did it by modifying the "windows" in panel.cfg.  When I finally get this all figured out, I'd like to put those on a nice wooden panel and have them all come up at once.  Ah well ... there's always tomorrow.

These seem to be all the instrumentation we need.   Boy, that takes some "figuring out" putting those things in their place ... not real intuitive. :-)

Anyway, that's how I spent my day!

D

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 14, 2011, 11:55:08 PM
I like it.  (I spent my day "wishing" I could work on my fsx!).  I tightened the steering down a little more tonight before posting the new config files.  Working like a champ so far. 

I see now what you were saying about the top-down view.  I though you were driving IN that view.

PS-I've settled on the C208's water rudder switch.  Everyone should have one of those.  It's kinda ugly, but they can swap it for one they have, if they know how.  It's very easy to do.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 15, 2011, 01:39:00 PM
Jeff ... made it all the way from Misty's Place (PF21) to Totem Bight without touching anything. Ran it about  65 mph, it tracked all the way.  I'm not using your "new" config file, this is still the old one I have. The only two problems I noticed, it oscillated a little back and forth across the "flight path" ... not bad. And at "idle" it takes off ... I think the idle has too many revs going.  I'm betting you new approach will clear up the oscillation.

For anyone wanting to try the route, it is attached. It is a good one to "try" to see if your boat is "tweaked" to accomplish it.  Most cannot yet, Jeff is getting very close to having a boat that will follow the autopilot (as you can see from the above).

D

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 15, 2011, 08:59:39 PM
     Ah, so you've got your boat tracking now.  Good.  You should really get the updated cfg files.  I think the last changes I made were monumental ones towards the goal.  I can't think at the moment what I had done, as I just got home from work, and am just happy to sit down.  I think I decreased the bank angle, and increased the bank velocity.  Anyway, it's better than the earlier one.  I am finalizing the tower model, just need to clean up the config files. 
     I just installed your window into my Maltese Falcon.  I haven't started FSX yet, but I've been working on getting the Falcon working last night.  It's physics are much different from the Malibu.  I couldn't just copy from one to the other.  I've got to adjust everything differently for the Falcon.  And now I can check out your panel while I'm working on the falcon. (. . . and your new route, too)

Update:  Doug, on your panel window, put the switch line "AFTER" the GPS line and the switch will be on top of the GPS.  I've got it this way: . . .

Quote
gauge00=Bendix_King_Radio!Bendix-King Radio AP,  0,262,156
gauge01=Beech_Baron!Nav GPS Switch, 2,267,20,20
gauge02=Fs9gps!gps_500,  0,132,157,130
gauge03=FDCT2!water_rudder,  2,245,20,20
gauge04=Cessna172!Airspeed,8,70,50,60
gauge05=Cessna172!Whiskey_Compass, 64,90,30,20
gauge06=Cessna!Heading_Indicator,    100,70,50,60

     I just took a screenshot of your panel with the above configuration.  I put it into my Malibu.  I couldn't get the Falcon to steer right, so I threw up my hands, shook it off, and loaded the Malibu.  I'm heading to Misty's to run your course to Totem Bight.  I'll get back to the Falcon later.

     In the picture, you can see that I moved the Nav/GPS switch down a few pixels, and put the water rudder right above it, in the bottom corner of the GPS.  That corner was wasted space anyway, and I didn't want to go below the Nav/GPS and cover up the AP button. 
      So was that what you were asking?  If I could move the water rudder switch, and make it show up?  I guess the answer is YES. 

(remember.  We two are the only ones that can use the FDCT2!water_rudder switch.  No one will have that except you and me.)  Unless they get that floatplane pictured earlier in this post.  Otherwise it's the "Cessna208!Water-Rudder" for the masses.  Everyone has one of those.



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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 16, 2011, 12:07:09 AM
I'm trying to publish videos of my run to Totem Bight, but the darn thing won't upload to YouTube.  I have done it before, but for the past week I can't get one posted.  Keeps saying "network connection error" and quits.  I'm using Windows Live Movie Maker.  I wanted to show you how well it tracks now with the newer configuration.  (and using your panel, with a twist.)  I put the top-down window "docked" on the left side with the gauges.  Everything's on the left side now.  I undocked it, sized it to tall and skinny, then "docked" it.  It snapped back to the left side, to my surprize, but I like it there better.  If I can get the video to post, I'll give you the link to it.

Here's a screenshot I just took.  I'm in Ward lake at the moment, having followed that tiny river through the woods, and not gracefully either.  Hmm, I wonder if the fish are biting?

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 16, 2011, 08:26:51 AM
Could you resend me the config you are using with the "masses" autorudder?  My switch is showing for some reason, but that's good to know.  Found a different "autopilot" thing that might be better ... testing it out later this evening. 

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 16, 2011, 09:03:13 AM
Doug, by "masses" I just meant that the Cessna 208 is a plane that everyone has, so we should use its water rudder switch, as it is more universal.  You can just go to your water rudder switch line in panel.cfg and change "FDCT2!water_rudder" to "Cessna208!Water-Rudder" like this:

Change this line >gauge03=FDCT2!water_rudder,  2,245,20,20
 to read like this >gauge03=Cessna208!Water-Rudder,  2,245,20,20

As for the config files, I posted them.  You can get a new copy anytime.

Here's another link to them.  Updated:  4/3/11 at 1:10am PST.

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 16, 2011, 09:09:55 AM
That's what I needed.  I've been playing with that airboat Dieter sent us.  Up the rivers it is terrific.  I tried the Deltasim Daisy last night ... goes in a straight line. Doesn't sense the course at all. That and the tug would be good blue water boats for the area. Just for fun, I'll put the water rudder into the Daisy and see what happens.   Thanks for the files.

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 16, 2011, 09:15:45 AM
Wow, you're fast.  I had to change a line in the panel.cfg to put the "cessna208 water rudder switch onto your panel window, so download the zip again.


PS- I can't get anything to upload to Youtube, so I gotta figure that problem out before I can post any more videos. 
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 16, 2011, 09:39:24 PM
OK, got the new configs in there.  I don't see the water rudder switch ... maybe I don't have it in my gauges file?  Is this an actual switch you can "see?"  I'm still having trouble with the boat idling at about 10 mph, so you can stay still by pulling the throttle back.  Also, I'm finding it tracks best at 60 mph. Faster, it can jump off the track on a turn. So maybe backing off the revs in one of those lines will hold speed at "tracking speed" of 60 mph and solve the too fast idle problem?  Made the run tonight, lost it on the turn up to the east narrows by Pennock Island.  Did it again there at 60 mph , tracked fine.  (Learning as we go!).
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 16, 2011, 11:03:05 PM
     Hey Doug, the cessna208 switch should be right where the other one was, It is ugly, and kinda hard to see.  (it is colored green and brown, I think.)  It should be just above the NAV/GPS switch, on the radio stack, or if you press shift+1, it's on that panel too.  Also, shift+4 is your panel, and I think I changed that, in the zip file, to the cessna switch too.  That one is on the lower left corner of the GPS.
     I think the water rudders are up by default, so you need to press ctrl+w or use the switch to put them down right after loading your boat.  You should have that switch if you have all your default planes installed.
Note to everyone reading this -  Never uninstall default planes, as other planes may call for gauges from one of them.  Once, I had to help someone whose autopilot unit wouldn't show up, it was just a brown square, and no gauge.  Turns out that he had uninstalled the Maule some time earlier, and that's where the gauge was being called from.  (The brown square was the background plate for the gauge.)  He reinstalled the Maule and fixed the problem.  I'm sure you have all the default planes installed, and if you copy/pasted the cfg files, then everything should be in place.
     I have experienced the high idle situation, but I don't think it is a setting.  It was like that even before I changed any engine settings.  This is what I did.  I have a "CH Eclipse flight yoke", which has rotary switches on it.  I mapped one to do the function of the F2 and F3 keys.  (incremental throttle adjustment)  I can "dial" the throttle down to zero, and reverse.  It works like a dream.  No more embarrassing parking attempts.  I set the throttle levers to idle, then roll the switch 2 clicks left, and it comes to a stop.  One click forward brings the throttle levers to zero, and the boat sits there all day. (except for the wind pushing on me). 
----- Off Topic -----
     I am hesitant to fire up my FSX, because I am finally uploading videos to YouTube.  I've got one posted, and working on another now.  I don't want anything to mess up the progress, or slow it down.  It's already been an hour or more.  And the video is only 10 minutes long.  I just checked on it.  It says it is 42% complete, and has 151 minutes to go.  That's rediculous!  Is there a better way to share videos? 

     
Quote
Found a different "autopilot" thing that might be better ... testing it out later this evening. 

Have you checked this "autopilot" thing out yet?  Just wondering.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 18, 2011, 10:30:47 PM
No success with the "autothrottle" on the Malibu.  I've looked at every line I can think of, nothing I can see to control how it works, (or doesn't). 
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 18, 2011, 10:40:25 PM
I wish we could "capture" a guy like Chuck Dome and tie him to a computer until he would give us a "real" boat.  These things are "models" of boats set onto a piece of airplane software  ... they look good, but they sure don't act like a boat should!  If we could just get ONE right, we could copy it over and over for any model.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 19, 2011, 08:20:08 AM
How much of that aircraft.cfg file can we strip away?  It might be fun to see how much we can get rid of that the boat won't use then that would let us focus on the other parameters.     I'm trying to get the Daisy to respond ... no luck so far ... I hope it's not "speed" ... it only runs about 35 mph.  But again, if I could just get it to HOLD a course that would be great for this larger, slower boat. Using the "heading gauge" to tweak the course kind of give you something to do.   I'm also working on the Cruise Plan for Grenville. Going to make the nav buoys the key way points and then have 'sighting' way points where there is no buoy (turning into the final channel).  Then try to "write it up" in a format people would enjoy.  Working on that today.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 19, 2011, 11:57:20 AM
Hi Doug,
     To make the boat to faster, change these values -

[propeller]
thrust_scalar=2.8  // 2 (Parameter that scales the calculated thrust provided by the propeller. )
gear_reduction_ratio= 34.800 // 17.400 (The reduction ratio from the engine output rpm to prop rpm.)

[turboprop_engine]
power_scalar=1.5   // 1.1 (Changing this value affects the amount of power delivered by the engine to the propellor shaft.)
maximum_torque= 1900.000 // 1800.000 (Maximum shaft-torque available from the engine (ft-lbs).)

Try different values until you get the right effect.  Adjust by tenths at a time.

Jeff
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 19, 2011, 03:50:10 PM
I thought I'd share what I've been up to this morning.  I've acquired the Smit-Rotterdam, and am beginning to see tracking results from it.  If you want to get one of these, they're only $15 dollars U.S.. 
     I am about to post an update to the Malibu configs, to include the tower model.  I've also created a run from Misty's to Bell Island Hotsprings, and one coming back to Misty's.
     Why don't I have "Misty's Place" on my Plan-G map?  I have a bunch of SPB's but not Misty's, or the airstrip either.  I imported the data that I downloaded from the resource page, and got forest service cabins locations, etc, but no Misty's.  Is your Plan-G map like that too?

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 19, 2011, 06:10:26 PM
Jeff ... did you Download Dieter's PLAN-G update ... you can get it at the top of the map room.  Do you have PF21 on FSX as a starting point? (That's a dif problem).
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Dieter on March 19, 2011, 07:01:39 PM
Misty's Place/PF20 and seaport PF21 are not part of my Plan-G datas.
All RTMM sceneries that have an own afcad-file (PFxx) get  automatically into Plan-G after re-built of the database.

Dieter
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 19, 2011, 09:10:13 PM
OK ... I had the same problem. Go to Enhancements and download the Misty Float Planes at the top ... the files are in there that create the airports.  Give it a try.

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 19, 2011, 11:08:48 PM
OK ... I had the same problem. Go to Enhancements and download the Misty Float Planes at the top ... the files are in there that create the airports.  Give it a try.

D
Ok, I tried.  I downloaded and installed the updated aifloatplane files, reloaded fsx and plan-g, rebuilt the database, and I'm sitting at Misty's place, by the lighthouse.  The Misty airstrips don't show.  There are alot of other seaplane bases and airports, but no Misty's on the map.

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: GrahamP on March 19, 2011, 11:26:00 PM
Jeff,

I think you're saying that Plan-G doesn't read PF20 and PF21 from the FSX data base.

I get the same for all the PF designations for Misty airports.  They show up in FSX but Plan-G doesn't see them when I build the FSX database.

I do have the Misty AI Floatplanes in my Misty folder at the top of the scenery library.

Not knowing enough about it, I just thought the way the Misty guys have coded it might be different from the way other airports are coded in FSX.  I have accepted that and marked the Misty airports on Plan-G manually.

It doesn't really bother me but I agree it would be better if Plan-G could see them in the database.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Dieter on March 20, 2011, 03:25:45 AM
Very strange phenomenon!
Do you use latest version 2.0.5.493?
http://www.tasoftware.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=1438.0

Dieter
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: GrahamP on March 20, 2011, 03:29:32 AM
Not yet.  Still on build 492.  I haven't patched it to 493 yet but I don't think the patch changes anything in that department.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Dieter on March 20, 2011, 04:08:00 AM
You are right, I'm afraid ,too.
I don't think it's a RTMM scenery problem, it's more like in Plan-G.
Maybe you'll have to check their forum or ask Tim Arnold for help.

Dieter
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Dieter on March 20, 2011, 04:25:56 AM
Have a look at page 18 in Plan-G manual. (Figure 16)
Maybe here's a solution.

Dieter
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 20, 2011, 04:53:02 AM
Quote
Have a look at page 18 in Plan-G manual. (Figure 16)
Maybe here's a solution.


Thanks, guys.  That did the trick.  I added the RTMM airports directory and now Misty's is there.  Well, I also added the Misty's Place entry too.  And I opened FTX Central and re-applied the North America region.  So one, or all of those things did it.  I should've done each process separately, I guess.  But it's fixed.



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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: GrahamP on March 20, 2011, 06:23:38 AM
Hmmmmmm, glad you've got it working Jeff but it hasn't worked for me.  I've browsed to the locations of fsx.exe and scenery.cfg and added the Misty Moorings scenery folder like the manual says.   Large, medium and small airports are ticked.

I can see the stock FSX airports like PAKT, PANT, CYPR, etc. in Plan-G, so something must be communicating.  I just don't see the PF ones in Plan-G even though I get them in FSX.

At least now I know it can work, so thanks for that.  I'll investigate some more.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Dieter on March 20, 2011, 07:00:10 AM
Did you re-built database after that?

Dieter
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: GrahamP on March 20, 2011, 08:15:31 AM
Did you re-built database after that?

Dieter

Aha.  No but now I have and it works.  Thanks for that :)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 24, 2011, 11:20:28 PM
     Ok, back to the BOATS.  Here's what I've come up with so far.  If you've been following the thread, you know I've been converting the airplane's autopilot to work on boats.
     The "airplane" autopilot turns the plane using the ailerons to tilt the plane.  A boat turns by changing the angle of the rudder in the water.  So, to transfer the forces from the ailerons to the rudder, you have to add a missing line to the [airplane_geometry] section.  The line is :

aileron_to_rudder_scale=8.0       // (Links ailerons to rudders)

Put a value representing the scale you wish for this action.  Larger values equal more rudder/less aileron.  OK, so we have power to the "rudders".  But alas, there are no rudders installed.  So in the [contact_points] section you have to add some.  They look like this:

[contact_points]
;/1  Class  (0 = None, 1 = Wheel, 2 = Scrape, 3 = Skid, 4 = Float, 5 = Water Rudder)

point.13=5, -110.200,   -15.50,    -3.95,     9600,  0.0,   0.0,   45.0,  0.15,  0.35,    0.9,  1.2,  0.0,  0.0,  0.0,  0.0
point.14=5, -110.200,    15.50,    -3.95,     9600,  0.0,   0.0,   45.0,  0.15,  0.35,    0.9,  1.2,  0.0,  0.0,  0.0,  0.0


The first number after the "=" sign is a "5".  That is water rudders.  Here's the link to the aircraft.cfg information from Microsoft.  Bookmark this link into your browser, for a quick reference while editing your cfg files.  This document explains what all the other numbers are for, as well as everything else in an aircraft.cfg file.

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc526949.aspx#mozTocId942782

     Now we have rudders, and the autopilot can steer them.  How well it does this is another can of worms.  Since the autopilot section is just a copy of a C208's autopilot, the settings are not correct for the craft you are trying to steer.  Hopefully, the first thing you'll notice is the boat turning on its side, listing to the left and the right.  You can tighten that up by adjusting the "bank angle".  In the [autopilot] section, find the "max_bank=" line, and reduce it to some single digit number, like 2 or 5 degrees of bank.  While you're there, change your "max_pitch" reference to "1.0".  Or it could just keep going in a straight line.  The autopilot settings are too weak to cause a reaction from the boat.
    (see edit below)  I have found so far, that the boat doesn't steer as well at low speeds.  I am working on that problem.  The lines of the [autopilot] section that begin with "nav_" are for controlling the linear navigation of the autopilot.  How fast it turns, how tightly it tracks, etc.  I am still experimenting with this section, to get the boat to track more tightly, and at lower speeds.  The lines that start with "gs_" are what control the vertical aspects of the autopilot.  (The glideslope).  We have no interest in this section, being earthbound as we are, in a boat.
     Autothrottle so far is a wash.  I have not been successful in my attempts to control or change that.  Attempting to activate autothrottle results in the engines powering down.  Very strange.  Still, could be useful if you wanted to "power down" your boat. (come to a stop). 

(edit-It is possible for the autopilot to steer at slower speeds, I have found.  By increasing the values of the rudder and aileron area, and the autopilot's proportional control constant, integrator, and derivative control constants, increasing the rudder and aileron effectiveness, increasing the aileron to rudder scale, increasing the roll and yaw stability, and rudder trim effectiveness, increasing the parasite drag scalar, decreasing the yaw damper gain(to -1500 or so).  I've probably missed something in there, but if you can juggle all those numbers, throw them into the aircraft.cfg file in the right proportions, and get your boat reloaded in memory correctly, it may work.  (I was so happy to see lateral movement that I felt like Dr. Frankenstein awakening the monster for the first time.  "Whoo hoo!!!  I think it moved.  Did you see that!!!"  That makes the hours on end, of trolling through the Fjords, hoping for a reaction, all worthwhile.)

     Sorry this isn't a "how to" manual.  I don't know yet if I can explain what I've done.  Many hours of tweaking and experimentation with radical number values, just to see what happens.  I wish there was a reference manual for the settings in the aircraft.cfg file that tells what are acceptable ranges or values for each item.  I am stabbing in the dark with every attempt, sometimes making things better . . . and sometimes horribly worse.

     That's my (updated) story so far.  I hope more people start working on this problem, and we can pool our knowledge to get a "boat" with a "boat autopilot", instead of a plane that looks like a boat, and an airplane autopilot controlling it over the water.  If you've made it this far, thanks for reading it.  Happy tweaking!
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 25, 2011, 09:17:32 AM
Amazing what you are finding.  I dropped some bait in the water over at FS Shipyards saying you were working on this aspect and if anyone had and interest in boat/autopilot to drop by here and offer an idea or two. 

The auto throttle, that confirms what I found, that when you try to set it, the engine stops. That one makes no sense at all.

One thing I'm playing with is getting RID of the things that don't apply to boats in the "aircraft.cfg".  I'm putting // ahead of things, but not knowing what a lot of them do (and I learned a bunch from your post) I can knock out the wrong ones.  As you play with these, could you be putting // in the "don't count" lines?  Then I'd grab yours later and go in and take all those lines out ... then re lable areas with the //

for instance // ----------------- rudder control --------------------------

Then we'd know where to go to tweak.  I played with those contact points a couple of weeks ago and the boat literally danced on the water ... (uh, that didn't work!). So I stay away from those.

The tug config you gave me is working very well.  With the larger ship, we tend to stay in blue water where the fine tuning adjustment isn't so important.  I ran the Grenville again using it WITHOUT the autopilot, using my new ship's wheel window. ('cept the wheel doesn't show). I just tweak the "heading" knob to set the new course when I hit a way point. You can follow the gps track easily that way, when you get to the next way point, you just tweak the knob and put a new heading on it and the boat tracks to it.  Worked very well. I wrote up that cruise and put "real" way points in it so it could be done this way.  I used many of the nav buoys as way points. It's not "autopilot" but it is a very interesting way to "sail."

I'll start playing with some of your settings today.

Doug
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 25, 2011, 02:48:53 PM
Quote
I ran the Grenville again using it WITHOUT the autopilot, using my new ship's wheel window. ('cept the wheel doesn't show).

     I was wondering, is the "BMP" file for the ship's wheel in the texture folder for the boat your using?  If it's not, it won't show up.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 26, 2011, 12:44:49 AM
     I've discovered that when you honk the horn of your boat, you will slow down.  Honk it again, and it speeds back up.  They use the "G" key for the horn, that's the "Landing Gear" button.  I think it puts invisible wheels down, and causes drag.  The effect is like shifting into low gear.  It's good for trolling, or taxiing into and out of port.  Try it out.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Dragnhorn on March 26, 2011, 12:49:06 AM
Don't have the time or the boats you're working on yet, but I'm enjoying the tech speak and following this thread with great interest!    :D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 27, 2011, 08:19:29 PM
Rob, if you get one, get the Malibu, that's the only one that is "reliable" at this point.  Jeff is making progress on the others, but I'm pulling my hair out with the "tug" today.  But I can get the Malibu to track all the way from Prince Rupert to Hartley Bay, and then from Hartley down to Bella Bella ... no problems. If we could just get one of the bigger boats to do so well, then we'd be set.  If you look over on the other forums, people "talk" about it, but nobody has been able to accomplish what Jeff has so far.  One guy said we already have autopilot, just hit CTRL-H.  Yeah ... and guess what, the heading doesn't change, but don't hit it and it doesn't change either! But if you put a heading gauge in a minipanel and try to hit control H ... it WILL not change, so that's bogus.

The darned things are just airplanes without wings ... too bad somebody can't "model" a boat for FSX. I wrote to DeltaSim, the only guy really selling these things ... he said he was "too busy" to work on the autopilot. Oh me.  Well, back to the workshop.

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 28, 2011, 01:12:18 AM
Doug,
     I was ready to post my configs first thing this morning, then remembered that I needed to copy the "tower Malibu's" config to the regular Malibu's file, so I did.  Oops!!!  Something went wrong, and I had to start all over with the configs from the zip file.  I had to re-tune one, (the tower model), and transfer the appropriate info to the other.  Now it's 9:30 pm, and the final test run is under way.  I went back and fine tuned the driveability factors while I was there, and balanced them out with the "autopilot mode".  (You can get it tracking great, and switch to manual mode and it drives like crap.)  Now I can control the cornering much better.  So now it's at a happy medium.  I was driving around some little islands just before Bella Bella, doing "barrel races" style turns around them and the handling is pretty good now.  The autopilot still takes its time making turns, but if you "honk your horn" just before the sharper corners, it will slow down for the corner.  Then, honk again if you want to speed back up.  I was cruising on autopilot for part of a run at 35-40 knots (rpm's at 2000, and horn honked) for about 15 to 20 miles.  It worked just fine, but was a little too slow for my taste.
     Sorry to hear that the Deltasim guy doesn't have the time for the autopilot.  He does make good boats though.
     I think the Malibu's are acceptable now, so I'll post those soon.  I need to make a readme file for them.  Then I'll concentrate on the Smit-Rotterdam. 

I've been able to post a couple more videos, but it's hit and miss.  I thought I'd take snapshots instead.  Here's some pics of one of my tugs pulling the QM2.  (All I'm missing is the big tow-rope from the ship to the tug.)



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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 28, 2011, 02:57:25 AM
Ok, if you're following the thread, and you like your updates in progressive order, here is another link to the updated Malibu configs.  As of March 27, 2011, at 11:43 pm PST, these are working pretty good now.  (I also updated the other two links in this thread(replies #8, and #17) with the new versions.)  Any BETA testers out there?  Try these out with Doug's sailplans, and enjoy the scenery from a boat, without having to pay attention to your driving. (well, not too much anyway.)  I gotta go to bed!!

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 28, 2011, 07:57:09 AM
THE MOORINGS - (Alpha Page)

For the "boaters among us" ... I've got an "alpha" page I'm working on for the boating enthusiasts.  It is at http://www.return.mistymoorings.com/moorings/ (http://www.return.mistymoorings.com/moorings/) (not linked to any of the pages).  It is far from finished, but it is taking shape. We will be posting Jeff's Tuneups there in the "Marine Maintenance Shop" along with some other things we're working on. If you have any ideas for it, let us know.

I put this up because we keep referring to the cruises, and I actually have them posted on the alpha page. So you folks can bookmark that one and try out the cruises if you like, they are all operational. You can click on the zip to get the "Flight Plan" which we are calling a "sail plan" ... so you can keep these separate in your FSX Documents library, their naming will be like this:  VHR SP Misty's Place to Wrangell ... the SP will tell you it comes from The Moorings.  The Map gives you a quick overview of the trip and the Trip Tic is for boating. 

There are a couple of ways to do the cruises. The Malibu on autopilot is terrific. (I watch the minipanel and keep my speed at 60 mph and it tracks perfectly).  But for the larger boats like the tug, another way is also fun. You actually use the chart. At a waypoint, you look at your next course heading and set it arriving at the next one and changing again. This is pretty realistic and I've tried to make the waypoint the nav buoys and all are named after features.  The cruises look "easy" but the Grenville Cruise took about 8 hours to complete.

FSDiscover! is a big help for you and makes viewing the landscape far more interesting because you know the names of things. I put in over 40 data points on the Grenville cruise, 30 some for Hartley to Bella. As I do a cruise, I make sure I've got the major features in there (using My Topo) and then the waypoint names are realistic. Using FSDiscover! I set the options for about 5 miles distance.  Also, if you make the POI (Points of Interest) a different color, then you can see all the things we've added for you.  Any data point showing up from us has an (MM) after it or (MC) for the USFS cabins. (So if you see an error on one, you'll know it's from us ... conversely, if you see an error and that is not present, then the error is in the global database ... and there are errors ... I've listed those I've found at the bottom of the dat file). If you go to the map page and click on the Quick Find Data Base and you'll see all the way points I've put into the rtmm dat file.

The "My Topo" people have done a great job with thier web page and we've found a little trick they've added there. You can get the url for the exact map you are viewing by clicking on a small link. For the cruises, there are some tricky approaches ... so we now can list those. Clicking on those in the navigation area gives you a close up of a target area. Since the Trip Tics (Sail Plans) are web-based, I may start putting links to critical areas right inside them.

Again, this is all experimental. But if you are interested in trying one ... I suggest getting the Malibu and giving it a try.  On the longer cruises (Grenville Channel) ... I put the sim rate on X2 to speed it up a little. But as Jeff says, what you don't want to miss is the scenery along the way.

It is amazing how the "point of view" really changes PFJ.  When you are down on the water, the landscape and topography come alive. Just going down the Grenville, you won't believe how the land changes, and of course the mountains are magnificent when you are looking "up" at them. 

This truly is a whole new experience for those that like it.  We are making The Moorings page to keep the boating separate from the flying. I didn't want flight plans and sail plans to get all mixed into the same bag. 

Again, if you have ideas for the alpha, let us know.

Doug

Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 29, 2011, 02:36:20 AM
Doug,
     Try this.  The tug is working great for me now.  See what you think.

(sorry to be so short, but it's 11:30 pm, and I'm off to bed.)  I just cruised from Hartley to Bella Bella, hands free, except for one spot, the channel was too narrow after the 35 degree turn.  I even made it around Mckay, which is a 65 degree corner.  (and at 35-45 knots too.)

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 29, 2011, 09:50:42 AM
Jeff ... it looks good so far, got to really try it out later this evening.  I put it up in the Maintenance shop on The Moorings http://www.return.mistymoorings.com/moorings/#b (http://www.return.mistymoorings.com/moorings/#b)  We'll just keep your latest "update" there.  I made a note that this is "beta" and probably would change and that folks should rename their original aircraft.cfg and panel.cfg.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 29, 2011, 09:08:53 PM
Doug,
     Things are coming together nicely.  Did you want to post the Malibu's configs up there too?  I am about to start on the Scirocco GTX.
     Oh, did you install the update for the tug?  Should I install it?  It says it adds a landable helipad to the tug.  Wow, do I even need that?  What kind of update is that?  There is already a helipad on the tug I'm currently using, but I haven't even thought of how I'd use it.  I think I'd have to record a cruise, and then play it back while flying a heli.  It might be fun, but I have enough trouble just trying to land on a stationary pad.  And rooftops are enough challenge for me right now.
     Do you have FSRecorder?  I was wondering if those recordings are share-able.  So instead of posting a video, I'd just give you the recording I made.  You could play it back on your computer.  (as long as you have the same boat as the recording.  Watching it go would be the same as watching a video of it going.  FSRecorder is new to me, so I don't really know much about it yet.  It sure is fun though.
     Ok, I'm going to fire up FSX and get started on the Scirocco.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 29, 2011, 09:33:04 PM
I didn't post the Malibu yet, but I put the tug up there.  Dex and I are "wondering" ... he has made AI traffic of the Daisy, the Riva and the Tug!  And they work. But now we are wondering what to do with them.  We may have to talk to the DeltaSim guy.  But he as made it all work.  So you could use that ... go find it and land on it!  We've got to figure out who goes to Jail, me or Dex??? :-)

I ran the Gemini 94 tonight on the new Bella Coola to Ocean Falls cruise (just posted it at The Moorings). If this doesn't convince people they need to get DOWN ON THE WATER, nothing will. I must have "snapped" 30 screen shots during the trip ... everywhere you looked it was absolutely spectacular.  I'll discuss the cruise in another thread.  But I ran it VFR using the Gemini ... beautiful trip.

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 29, 2011, 10:46:49 PM
Doug,
     I just downloaded the Bella Coola to Ocean Falls route.  I am going to use that for working on the Scirocco.
     I'm not sure I understand what you're talking about with the AI boats. (oh, if it's ok to use them for AI, since they are payware?)  JJJackson said he is a retired lawyer.  Maybe he could help in this matter.  I don't know why the Deltasim guy would have an issue with it.  The boats were purchased originally, and the AI traffic can't be pirated, can they?
     I don't know.  I'd better just get back to my autopilot thing.  I hope that's OK with the Deltasim guy.  By the way, aren't we boosting boat sales for him?  He should be working with us.  I, personally, have purchased several of his boats so far.  And have plans to purchase more of them, as I can.

     edit - I just opened the Scirocco folder, and inside it is a text file, "copyrights.txt".  Maybe that can shed some light on the issue.  If I posted that file, as an attachment, would that infringe on his copyrights?  I'm starting to hate copyright laws.  Can we get his permission, then?

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 30, 2011, 07:28:27 AM
Usually we find the copyright laws are only there to keep people from making money on work others have done. It's the "making money" part that should be "key."  I've got a copyright statement on our ABOUT page. But what I'm saying is that what we make here, we willingly share with others with ONE exception, they cannot SELL it to make money for themselves.  That has been the "standard" with this community.  That standard has, unfortunately, changed with some of the newer people coming into the game.  We buy a scenery package, but then cannot use the objects in a "freeware" package even though nobody could "see" the objects had they not bought the scenery ... but that makes no difference, policy is policy. It's a new game for the simming world ... I don't like it, but that's the direction it is going.

I don't know if we can "see" the AI Tug Dex has made if we haven't bought the scenery ... but if you don't have Tongass X, you can't see some of those objects.  So if that's the case, what's the problem? You've bought it, so you can see it. If you didn't buy it, it's not there. And people have bought Tongass X so they could "see" the objects. The guys making the money still get their money. I don't see how posting and object that you've already purchased would infringe on a copyright law ... but you see, I'm being logical, I'm not a lawyer! :-)

So I guess we have to be very careful with the new "standards".  Sort of like Kindergarten ... I'll share my toys with you, but you won't let me play with yours. To me, that's not the way it should be done, so we do it the old-fashioned way. And today we just passed 30,000 hits ... not bad for a little non-profit site, so I guess people appreciate our policy. But I really think sharing should be a two way street. Only Francois seems to understand that.

We can always ask for permission ... a couple of the OZx folks gave us permission for their objects (we have them thanked properly in the "friends" section), but others simply refused our query.  So it seems to be an individual thing.  We should ask each time we want to try something. Dex got permissions on the AI boats from Francois (Tongass X).  So its always good to ask.

I think Dex did the black tug, I'm putting it in today. So he'd have to do the red one with the heli pad. But it seems you could put that in as AI and then land the heli on it. 

What I'm really enjoying with this project is watching you people take a basic "format" and add some magic to it to come up with something entirely different.  FSX on the rivers sucks. But ORBX comes along with PFJ and adds the magic ... bingo, a whole new ball game.  Dex just "adapts" things ... sort of like its a normal thing for anybody to do ... but it's that same magic that makes something special happen for those of us who haven't a clue how he does it. Chris does it with the planes, Brad and Kim have done all kinds of amazing things for the scenery packages ... and look what you are doing on the boats.  Fun stuff.

It's a great team ...

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Dexthom on March 30, 2011, 10:21:15 AM
What AI??  I know nothing....   :-X
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 30, 2011, 10:29:56 AM
Yep, you can tell Dex doesn't want to go to jail .. that just leaves "me" holding the bag! :-)  We're not "posting" anything, but it is amazing to watch what Dex "doesn't" do!

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 30, 2011, 08:56:42 PM
Dex who?
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 31, 2011, 02:21:37 AM
I've been working on the Scirocco this evening.  Frustrating at first, then in desperation, I started copying sections of the tug's config to the Scirocco.  Some tweaks on that, and Viola!  I present to you the Scirocco GTX with autopilot.  And it's free.  I know now why it is free.  Jeez!  What a basket case to start with.  All better now, though.  Have fun.



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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 31, 2011, 09:27:33 AM
Jeff ... I put this config "up" so folks can get it. I also put the Scirocco in the "Marina" section so folks can get that one too.  Now there's no excuse for not trying a boat ... FREEWARE!!!
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 31, 2011, 10:03:49 AM
It sure doesn't like to turn!  But on a semi-straight track, it stays right on it. The only thing I noticed were the "splash (forward) contact points" may be a little off. They need to be a little shorter, the splash is happening in front of the bow.  It's amazing that you can get any of this to work.  There are several models of the Scirroco ... which one are you using the GTX2?

D

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: archangel1 on March 31, 2011, 10:07:53 AM
Any chance of doing something with Hama's freeware Riva? Like I mentioned before in another post, the only issue I have with the Malibu is that there is no 'pilot' in the external views while the Riva does.  It would be a slight distraction from my enjoyment of the cruise.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 31, 2011, 10:26:03 AM
As a matter of fact, I am working on the Riva right now.  It is shaping up nicely, but I've got to go to work, so will have to put it on hold until I get home tonight.  Check back later on my progress.  (I can't find the button to turn the wipers off.  ha ha.  Minor detail.) 
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on March 31, 2011, 10:30:12 AM
It will be great to have the RIVA.   I just put the link up to the Riva in The Marina on The Moorings page.  And if you folks find other freeware boats that you think would fit in, let me know, we'll link to them.

D

Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on March 31, 2011, 10:03:44 PM
The boats are a work in progress.  There are alot of things yet to be done.  Your observations are noted, and I am working to resolve the problems.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on April 01, 2011, 05:10:03 PM
Just a note about placing items in a panel.  If you want a switch to show up, on top of another gauge, you have to put it after the underlying object.  For example, I just put a water rudder switch onto the lower left corner of my GPS.  The GPS must be higher in the list than the water rudder switch.  Even if you don't intend to stack items, when you're placing them and you can't find the switch you just placed, it may be under something else at the moment.  Reposition it at "0, 0, " and it should show up in the top left corner of your panel.  Then you'll know it is showing up.
_________________________________________________________________
[Window03]
Background_color=0,0,0
size_mm=156,308
window_size_ratio=1.000 
position=8
visible=0
ident=NAV_STACK_PANEL
window_size= 0.200, 0.500
window_pos= 0.0, 0.500

gauge00=737-400!Autopilot,   22, 267, 134, 30
gauge01=Beech_Baron!Nav GPS Switch, 3,266,15,31
gauge02=Fs9gps!gps_500,  0,132,157,130
gauge03=Turbo_Beaver!water_rudder,  3,245,15,20

gauge04=sirocco_gtx2!speed_indicator,  8,76,40,52
gauge05=Magnetic_Compass!Magnetic-Compass,57,76,42,53
gauge06=Cessna!Heading_Indicator,    105,76,46,55
_________________________________________________________

I hope this helps.

The Turbo Beaver's water rudder switch is less ugly than the Cessna 208's.  My Turbo Beaver was a freeware download though, so is not a default plane.  I'll have to keep looking.

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on April 01, 2011, 06:51:59 PM
I'm working on the Scirocco GTX2 at the moment, and I thought I post a screenie of the corrected wake effects.  No progress on autopilot response while going 12 knots. (or 30 knots, either).  The weekend is still young.  It's just a matter of time before I win this fight.

Edit - I am winning the fight, and eventually we'll have them all working.  I can now get the Scirocco to track at 12 knots.  (Just like grass growing, you have to use a time-lapse camera to see the action, but it's working.)

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on April 02, 2011, 12:23:28 AM
Spud,
     I've got the Scirocco tracking at 25 knots.  Man, this is like watching grass grow.  You can go 13-15 knots by easing off the throttle, but it probably won't hold the track very well going that slow.  It was doing it, but I almost fell asleep waiting for it to come in line.  I've been cruising from Wrangell to Misty's for about 3 hours, I think.  Spud, do you still want me to make its top speed 15 knots?  Currently the top speed, full throttle, is 39 knots.  But that's overrevving the engine, and you should keep the rpm's in the green (between 2000/2500 rpm) Here's a visual at 25 knots.

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on April 02, 2011, 08:10:43 AM
Jeff, I've been running the sim rate at X 2 once I get a boat going. So it speeds up the time, but they are slow enough you don't get the jerky turning, etc.  But a "slow" boat at 15 will be going an actual 30.  I like to do that out on the open water ... in the sharp turns I keep the sim rate on "normal."  So "real slow" isn't a problem with the X 2.

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: spud on April 02, 2011, 09:31:51 AM
Spud,
     I've got the Scirocco tracking at 25 knots.  Man, this is like watching grass grow.  You can go 13-15 knots by easing off the throttle, but it probably won't hold the track very well going that slow.  It was doing it, but I almost fell asleep waiting for it to come in line.  I've been cruising from Wrangell to Misty's for about 3 hours, I think.  Spud, do you still want me to make its top speed 15 knots?  Currently the top speed, full throttle, is 39 knots.  But that's overrevving the engine, and you should keep the rpm's in the green (between 2000/2500 rpm) Here's a visual at 25 knots.

Jeff,
 that is a no on the speed for the Scirocco it is fine.  I was talking about the Tug when I put the .cfg file in the thing goes like the mythical bat out of he|| .  I have not researched it but my WAG is that 18-20 Kts. would be about all the Tug could do.  If it will not track at the low speed then 25 Kts. 'could' be used I guess.  ::)
 8)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on April 02, 2011, 09:46:24 AM
I am going with the X2 setting. 

I re-mapped the engines.  Now using one or the other causes the boat to curve in the correct direction.  You can "help" the steering by favoring the engine on one side or the other.  Full right engine will push you left, and vice versa.  They were backwards originally.  (oops, I just ran aground 'cause I'm typing while boating)  I'm going past PAKT at the moment, almost to Misty's.  Just a couple more corners to go.  I'm currently running at 12 knots.  No room for error going through the channel.  I can see Misty's on the GPS screen now.

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on April 02, 2011, 09:50:57 AM
Good morning Spud.  The tug is next on my list.  I think I've got the Scirocco dialed in pretty good now.  I had doubts that I could get it tracking so slow, but I did it.  Now I can use what I've learned to tweak the tug. 

Edit - Hmm, I just hit a snag with the Scirocco.  The amount of fuel GREATLY effects the performance.  I had already reduced it from 8000 per tank, to 2000 to lighten it up.  It was running good like that.  Then I emptied the tanks, and now it is very unstable.  It's too light with no fuel, so what to do.  I recommend that you always run with a full tank, I suppose.  I could make the tanks tiny, and put the weight on the boat instead.  I'd adjust the fuel rate so it doesn't run out so quickly.  Do you care about "realistic fuel consumption"?  I've always run FSX with "unlimited fuel" checked anyway.  I don't care about that aspect of the sim, except when I made my "Around the world" trip last year.  What do you think?
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on April 02, 2011, 06:12:59 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PID_controller (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PID_controller)
http://www.flightsim.com/vbfs/showthread.php?208174-PID-Controllers-And-Aircraft.Cfg (http://www.flightsim.com/vbfs/showthread.php?208174-PID-Controllers-And-Aircraft.Cfg)

I've been doing some light reading today.  These articles talk about the PID control methods used by the autopilot.  Now I feel smarter.  ;D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on April 02, 2011, 06:54:57 PM
Well, I'm glad you read it and feel smarter, I read it and feel dumber! :-)   No, actually that is pretty cool stuff ... I've worked with PIDs before and have even applied the theory to human parameters (another too long story) ... but I didn't realize that is what was happening here.  This is VERY interesting!!

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on April 02, 2011, 07:27:06 PM
Yes, thanks to those articles, I am back on track with the Scirocco.  I had a setback when I discovered that the gradually emptying fuel tanks would bring on major instability.  I always run with a full tank, so I didn't realize this.  Today I did a test, changing the fuel tank levels to zero, and the boat just about jumped out of the water.  Why so much fuel anyway?  Is that realistic to have 16,000 gallons?  I collaborated with Spud, and concluded that two 400 gallon tanks would be plenty.  But all this threw the variables way off, so I had to start over tuning the autopilot.  Now, armed with knowledge, I have the Scirocco tracking again, with the new fuel tanks.  I re-adjusted the boats weight to account for the missing fuel, and changed the fuel consumption so the 800 gallons would last longer.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on April 03, 2011, 04:17:15 AM
I just put up the latest Malibu config files, in this thread, replies #8, and #17.  I hope they work as good for you as they do for me.  Let me know.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on April 03, 2011, 12:44:07 PM
Doug, I'm putting this version of your panel with my configs.  Unless I find a problem with doing so, the only non-default gauge is the digital speedometer.  That's a Scirocco gauge, so people would have to get the Scirocco for that to show up.  I made the Nav/GPS and water rudder buttons share the spot to the left of the 737 AP unit.  It looks better than putting it on the corner of the GPS.  They can upgrade to the better gauges later, if they want to. 

Oh, I noticed that I now have an F-111 in my hangar.  I think it came with one of the AI packages.  Not sure, as I don't remember acquiring it.  I'll have to check it out, and see if it's flyable, or just AI traffic.

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on April 03, 2011, 04:31:10 PM
Both of those, the F-111 and the Sirocco are freeware ... you could add a Gauge folder, put the two gauges in it and tell them to put it into their gauge folder.  Problem solved.  Looks great!  It sure makes it easier driving those things from the "outside" where you can see all the scenery.

I'm messing with the Freedom of the Seas .. it "hops" and there's no wake from the original download. Have you played with that one just for "graphics?"  The wake needs changing, it looks like its sitting still yet its going about 24 knots. The hopping is maddening. When you're on the instrument panel ... it hops and a voice says "don't sink" ...(you'd think you were on the Titantic!).   Maybe we should get that voice into all our boats just to remind people to watch for the rocks! :-)   I'm making making a very "real" cruise using FOS to leave Ketchikan, pass New Eddystone Rock and go up Rudyard Bay ... which is the exact route of the real ships on the Alaska cruises.  It would give folks a "feel" for what it is like. But a "hopping ship" and a captain that keeps yelling "don't sink" is disconcerting to say the least!

Also, (this to you or anybody else reading)... on the Gemini 94, you are "inside" looking out through obviously a "window" ... so the view is slightly hazed. Anyway to get rid of that darned haze?

D

Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on April 03, 2011, 08:17:37 PM
Doug,
     Ha ha ha, You got me laughing pretty good.  That is so funny!!  I think the static_pitch or static_height setting is off.  The "don't sink" guy is soooo annoying.  It is the "GPWS" (Ground proximity warning system) telling you to "Pull Up".  Map a key combo to turn it off.  I did that a long time ago.  Mine is "CTRL+SHIFT+1".  Some planes just won't shut up.  So I turn it off.  But the boat needs to be fixed, or disable the GPWS.  And the hopping around, too, suggests that the boat is not aligned correctly with the ground.
     A program called DXT1 Bitmap Manipulator (freeware) is what is needed to change the opacity/transparency of the window tint, I think.  It is a "must have" tool for anyone wanting to work with the texture files in fsx.
     I don't have "Freedom of the Seas", but I do have the Titanic, as a matter of fact!  I also have tall ships, submarines, The Queen Mary 2, an Orca Whale, a paddlewheel steamer, and the Deltasim tug, malibu, scirocco, Capricorn, and Maltese Falcon.  I probably missed a few, my collection is very large.  Don't get me started on flyers.  (about 300 of those, I think).  I also have a bald eagle, and a flock of geese.  Funny I never got an F-111 'til now.  I'll get the Freedom of the Seas and check it out.  Where did you get it from?
     Nevermind.  A quick google search, download button press, and viola, now I have the Freedom of the Seas, also.  I don't think that took 5 minutes.
     I am currently working on the tug.  I've gotten it to track at about 15 knots, but the engine needs adjusting, so it tops out at 18-25 knots.  I am close.  I had to step it up to 4X speed, just to see if it was actually tracking.  The Scirocco is being a booger, so I dropped it for the moment and decided to finish the tug instead.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on April 03, 2011, 10:12:54 PM
Tried to send you the zip here, but it timed out on me. So I sent it in an email for you.  "Driving" that thing gives you a very eery feeling.  It is BIG, it is SLOW and it RUNS OVER LITTLE BOATS without a SOUND!  You look ahead and realize that your turns have to be correct (or else).  I was coming down beside bold island ... egads what's that coming at me?  Dex strikes again, here comes the log barge. I had to stop to let it pass as we would have crossed paths ... crunch.  You are "high up" above the water on the bridge ... it gives you a feeling of "bigness" Hama did a heck of a job with this to "give such a feeling."  Not my favorite boat, but darn ... if you ever wondered what it "felt" like on the bridge of one of those things, you'll get the "feel" of it with this one.

I'm betting one of those texture files in the Gemini is "hazed" with that program you mentioned.  All it is is the full screen view window with a panel imposed on it. So If I can get to where they "hazed" it and take it out I'll be home free. I'll look into that program too.  Thank you.

d
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: archangel1 on April 03, 2011, 11:15:35 PM
The Smit Rotterdam is an impressive ship.  When I used to work part-time in a hobby shop, we had an R/C model of her on display for a while and even that was impressive.  However, when I was viewing DeltaSim's video on her, something kept bothering me.  She wallows, even when sitting still in a calm sea.  I can't quite decide whether it was the speed or the moment of the movement that was off-putting.  Is there a way to adjust that in the config file? Although I know enough to alter a file when instructed, there's no way I could look at one and say 'aha, just change these 2 numbers and bob's your uncle'.  (In my case, Bob actually was my uncle! ;) )
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on April 04, 2011, 01:52:55 AM
Quote
Nevermind.  A quick google search, download button press, and viola, now I have the Freedom of the Seas, also.  I don't think that took 5 minutes.
Doug,
     Thanks for sending me one, but I was trying to tell you that in 5 minutes after reading your post, I too have one.  I have it installed, but since I was working on the tug, I haven't checked it out yet.  Yes, the Titanic and QM2 are BIG like that too.  They are "Hama's" too.  I'll see about that hazy window first chance I get.
     Archangel1, yes there is a way to fix the listing, as that is what I've been working on all day.  Well, not the listing particularly, but that is one aspect of the stability.  You can go into the aircraft.cfg file, in the [flight_tuning] section and look for the line "roll_stability=30.00".  <---This line is actually from the tugs aircraft.cfg file.  Change it to something like say . . . 30.00. :D  That should help.  But if it doesn't do it good enough, just increase the numbers until it is good to go.  Or wait a few days, and I'll have this one tuned up.  (I don't want to throw the configs out there too quickly.)  More testing to do.  Right now it travels at 13-15 knots@2500 rpm.  Full throttle will get you about 30-35 knots.  Autopilot is working at 15 knots, but I wouldn't take my eyes off the course.  The faster you go, the better it tracks. 
     The girl (on the Titanic) in this picture gives me the willies.  Like looking at a ghost.  The other picture is the sun setting on me, as I'm leaving Wrangell, working on the tugs autopilot.

edit- I just re-read your post, Doug.  The "Gemini" has a hazy window, not the Freedom of the Seas.  I was not thinking straight.  The zip I downloaded is named "fsx_ship_freedom-fof-the-seas2.zip", and the one you sent me is "fsxfrdms.zip".  I wonder if they are the same.  Mine has a "2".  That usually means it's an update or something.  I can check them both out. Duh!  It's been a long day, and I start a new work schedule tomorrow.  I'll be working 4 10-hour days a week, 6am to 4:30pm.  M-Th.  I should be in bed already.  G'nite y'all.

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Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on April 06, 2011, 12:32:23 AM
     I was able to get another video to upload to Youtube.  It is the Smit-Rotterdam coming into Bell Island Hotsprings.  It was early in the autopilot project.  I made the video on March 20, 2011. 
     (The music starts 1 minute into the video.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sw8Fqjq-ps0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sw8Fqjq-ps0)
(sorry to german members, it says the video is banned in Germany, because of the music.)  It is Donovan/Atlantis.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Dexthom on April 06, 2011, 07:09:09 AM
If the music has a copyright, it gets banned in Germany.  My Misty Waters originally had a Titanic piece and
that was banned.  the only cure for that is to use music from FreePlay.com   :'(  I saw the Smit video.  When I get some time, I'll try a cruise.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on April 17, 2011, 09:09:06 AM
I just thought I'd touch base with anyone following this thread.  I am still working on the autopilots for the boats.  My newest twist is the autopilot's "yaw damper gain".  Activating it has turned the whole project on it's side, again.  So I've started over at square one, but with the yaw damper activated.  I won't post any more configs until I've tweaked and tested them to my satisfaction.  The Malibu is turning much more quickly now, but there are other aspects of the manueverability that have to be worked out.  So have patience, and eventually I'll get it all sorted out and share my conclusions.  This applies to all the boats I am working on.  I suggest staying with the original configs for now, while you wait.  Thanks.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Zexe on September 02, 2011, 04:45:18 PM
Sorry to open a rusted can, but I am interested in these configurations.  I just bought the Malibu myself yesterday and thought it would be nice to have an AP function, and my quest to search for it lead me here.  I've tested out the initial batch:

gauge00=Bendix_King_Radio!Bendix-King Radio AP,  0,262,156
gauge01=Beech_Baron!Nav GPS Switch, 2,267,20,20
gauge02=Fs9gps!gps_500,  0,132,157,130
gauge03=FDCT2!water_rudder,  2,245,20,20
gauge04=Cessna172!Airspeed,8,70,50,60
gauge05=Cessna172!Whiskey_Compass, 64,90,30,20
gauge06=Cessna!Heading_Indicator,    100,70,50,60

...however I don't quite understand how to get the ailerons and rudders working together and what type of effect it has on the boat. 

Anyways, I hope to one day cruise with you guys up North.  For now i am cruising down the Colorado River through Grand Canyon and also through Snake River in Idaho.  My other plan is to go down the Mississippi.  I'd love to join you guys on MP, however what is the server name and when do you guys plan on your next event?

Best,
Zexe ( Ze as in Zephyr, exe as in X)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on September 02, 2011, 06:04:19 PM
     Hi Zexe, sorry to have let my can get rusty.  I'm the one that does the autopilots on the boats.  I am here on the website every day.  I just got caught up in other things, as far as the autopilot goes.
     Anyway, I'd be happy to help.  The section you are referring to is a custom "navigation panel" that Doug Linn created for the boats.  Bring it up by press "shift+4" on your keyboard.  I have modified some to suit my personal taste, but he is the creator.  As far as the aileron/rudder system goes, I found that putting the "aileron_to_rudder_scale=" command line in the aircraft.cfg file's [airplane geometry] section switched control to the ailerons, rather than the rudders.  The effect is that the boat could be steered with the yoke, like a steering wheel instead of using your feet as in taxiing a plane.
     Do the config files work for you?  They work for me, but some have reported problems with tracking.  You can't use the autopilot for rivers.  It's best application is for covering large areas of open water, where you need to stay on course, automatically.  The malibu is my favorite boat.  Let me know how I can get you going.  Welcome to Misty Moorings. 8)

PS- Our MP sessions are hit and miss so far.  We've had some sessions, as you can see by the thread.  But lately, we've fallen off track.  I fly every Thursday evening, at 7pm Pacific with the "Midnight Aviation" guys, and on Sundays at 11am with a group at "Com-Central".  I, personally, would like to have a regular time set up at Misty's for us to get together, but being international, it's hard to accomodate everyone.  The server info should be in the Multiplayer thread.  We use the "Midav" server on thursday, and when I fly with com-central we use FSX's "gamespy" feature.  Misty's has a main server, which is down at the moment.  There is also a backup server, which I think is also down.  That's why we've been using the "Midav" server.  But since most people don't know that, there is only two of us that fly.  You can fly with us on Thursdays if you want to.  Yesterday we flew helicopters in the Grand Canyon.  A search and rescue scenario.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Zexe on September 02, 2011, 07:22:25 PM
Hey Jeff,

Thanks for the prompt reply.  I live in Japan and went out to get some morning sushi and by the time I came back there was a reply from you!  What a pleasant surprise!  Anyways I just tested the "aileron_to_rudder_scale=1" and it works just fine and dandy.  I saw somewhere on this site a place where I can download the navigation panel, so I will take a look into that.  The original navi panel that you posted on this thread works for me, however GPS tracking didn't seem to work.  I'll experiment to see what works. 

Other boats that I've purchased, well I got the Gemini which.... I love, makes me feel RICH!!  Thanks for the invite for Thursday, I'll definitely join you guys.  I have TS 3, but I love using the FSX ingame radio freq.     Anyways, hope to see you guys out there! 

peace,
Zexe
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on September 02, 2011, 08:32:23 PM
Ohio Goziymus Zexe, <--(I don't know how to spell that, but you know what I mean)
    Yes, about the GPS tracking.  That's why we added the "Nav/GPS" switch to the Nav panel.  So we could switch to GPS mode.  Here is a link to the panel:
 http://return.mistymoorings.com/moorings/maintenance/navstack/rttm_navstack.zip

That should get it to you.
                                          Saiyonara ;)

ps - we use Teamspeak 2 usually.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Zexe on September 02, 2011, 08:55:14 PM
Cool, I found that link just earlier and put it to the test, then realized that if I have to cross the pacific on Autopilot, well, I don't think it'll happen.  I should keep my eyes on the water instead of watching youtube episodes of Becker.  Anyways, thanks!

I tested out the FShost client and tried to connect to 70.41.2.196: 23456, however no luck.  I opened my ports and all, but because I am using a wireless wireless router called Wimax, I'm having trouble, either that the servers are down.  My firewall is disabled and so I've done everything on my side to make sure things will work, but all has failed.  I will test it through FSX direct connect.

I hope I can figure this out by next Thursday! 

Ohayougozaimasu!

Zexe
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on September 02, 2011, 10:10:25 PM
Quote
Ohayougozaimasu!
Thanks.  I don't think I've ever seen it written.  It's one word?  I only know a half a dozen words, anyway. 
This is the FS Host client and Teamspeak info for my thursday flights. *Info outdated and expired.
midav.hopto.org
port: 23459
password: (none)
TeamSpeak IP: 174.133.247.18:8814 (Alt IP: 216.86.148.174:8860)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: marc2140 on August 12, 2015, 02:54:58 PM
Hello
Since about a week I have started to add some water projects to my fsx.
When you start with boats, you quickly run into the need of a good autopilot. That's very difficult to find, but I thought that the RTMM Nav Stack would be the solution.
I downloaded it, try to install in on one of my ships, but with no result.
Attached picture of what I see . I wanted to add my panel cfg file, but I get the message that I cannot attach that kind of file.
I also get the impression that I am missing gauges.
Can anyone give me a solution?
Cheers
Marcel
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on August 12, 2015, 07:32:20 PM
Hello Marcel,
     The Nav-stack is my favorite panel, and I use it in any vehicle I can.  I have some that are modified for amphib planes, having a water rudder switch.  But Doug's Nav-stack panel from this thread is what you want for the boats.  It does look like you're missing a gauge.  The nav-stack panel is a rectangular area (or panel) that contains space to hold the gauges in.  There are several gauges in the various versions I have.  I believe we tried to keep the gauges generic or universal, except for "maybe" an F-111 autopilot, which we can help you obtain. 

To make a long story short, . . . I can help you with your problem.  ;)

About the boat autopilot, have you read this thread?  It is about that very topic.  There is more to do, than just install the nav-stack panel.  You must also activate the boats autopilot in its config file.  If you don't like steering with your rudder pedals, there is a fix for that also, in the aircraft.cfg file, to switch to ailerons which means steering with the yoke.

These are the gauges used in Doug's Nav-stack.  You need to have the gauges for the Beach Baron, Cessna 208, and Scirocco GTX.  The Scirocco GTX gauges are included in the zip for you.  Please read the "readme" file that is included in the zip.  Although, how could you not?  That is where the panel.cfg info is at.   :o

gauge00=Minipnl!AUTOPILOT F-111,   22, 267, 134, 30
gauge01=Beech_Baron!Nav GPS Switch, 3,266,15,31
gauge02=Cessna208!Water-Rudder,  0,20,20,20
gauge03=Fs9gps!gps_500,  0,132,157,130
gauge04=sirocco_gtx2!speed_indicator,  8,76,40,52
gauge05=Magnetic_Compass!Magnetic-Compass,57,76,42,53
gauge06=Cessna!Heading_Indicator,    105,76,46,55


Back in 2011, when we wrote this thread I tweaked the autopilot of my Malibu boat.  I discussed the process in this thread.  Maybe you can get some insight from it before starting your project.

Good Luck.   8)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: marc2140 on August 13, 2015, 04:45:23 AM
Thanks for the reply.
I'll try to find my way, but it is kind of hard to catch up with the 100 items that describe the whole process of coming to Doug's Nav Stack.
I managed to download and install the Sirocco Auto Pilot Nav Stack and tried it out.
I must say that I am not very convinced. I tried it out in the trip from the Bella Coola marina to Ocean Falls, but I often had to stop and correct manually, switch then to "heading" and when I was back on track again, use the Nav button again.
Is Doug's Stack any better? Or are there other things I need to change in the configuration of the ships? Does it help when you reduce speed to avoid the auto pilot to get "out of bounds"?
But maybe I first try to get the correct gauges. I don't think I have the F-111 autopilot minipanel. Could you tell me where to find it?
Thx
Marcel
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on August 13, 2015, 07:33:20 AM
I had great success getting the autopilot to track with my Malibu ski boat, and the North Star tugboat.  But many boats don't work so great on autopilot.  There are so many variables that affect turning radius and rudder effectiveness.  You can see by the thread that I spent some time experimenting with different settings.  The "Nav-Stack" does nothing to help the autopilot, except give you the actual autopilot device to use.  The magic is in the numbers of the boat's aircraft.cfg autopilot section.  I have boats that I could not get the AP to work at all.  The Deltasim Maltese Falcon is one.  It actually turns the opposite way to the desired direction of travel.  So keep that in mind.  Actually, I don't think I had much success with the Scirocco GTX either.  My Malibu works the best.  It tracks great, and stays right on beam. 

Unzip this file and add this minipnl.cab file to your gauges folder.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/mhmi7fua6eyddod/MiniPnl.zip?dl=0
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: marc2140 on August 15, 2015, 10:55:33 AM
Thank you Jeff for the file.
I'll try it out and see what is does.
Regarding the aircraft.cfg files, are there any guidelines if i want to experiment a bit, or is it just a shot in the dark? Are there any other autopilot settings where we can learn something from (maybe Helo's or cars, trucks, etc.)?
I will also try and work my way thru the complete thread, and see what I can make from it.
cheers
Marcel
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on August 15, 2015, 01:30:33 PM
It was the year 2011 when I did this, and haven't really thought much about it since.  I can show a copy of my Malibu autopilot section, which works great for my Malibu.  No claim that it will work on other boats though.  Always back up your original files, just in case.  ;)

;) Contact Points-I added a pair of water rudders for better turning. ;)
Quote
[contact_points]
;/1  Class  (0 = None, 1 = Wheel, 2 = Scrape, 3 = Skid, 4 = Float, 5 = Water Rudder)
;/2  Longitudinal Position        (feet)
;/3  Lateral Position             (feet)
;/4  Vertical Position            (feet)
;/5  Impact Damage Threshold      (Feet Per Minute)
;/6  Brake Map                   (0=None, 1=Left, 2=Right)
;/7  Wheel Radius                (feet)
;/8  Steer Angle                         (degrees)
;/9  Static Compression          (feet)  (0 if rigid)
;/10 Max/Static Compression Ratio
;/11 Damping Ratio / Water Rudder Effectiveness  (0=Undamped, 1=Critically Damped) / 1.0 = normal
;/12 Extension Time              (seconds)
;/13 Retraction Time             (seconds)
;/14 Sound Type
;/15 Airspeed limit for retraction (KIAS)
;/16 Airspeed that gear gets damage at (KIAS)
//      1       2           3          4        5     6       7       8       9     10      11       12    13    14    15    16

point.0= 4, 12.000, -1.200, -0.500, 9600, 0, 0.000, 20.000, 0.100, 1.000, 1.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0
point.1= 4, 12.000, 1.200, -0.500, 9600, 0, 0.000, 20.000, 0.100, 1.000, 1.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0
point.2= 4, -15.000, -2.400, -0.850, 9600, 0, 0.000, 20.000, 0.100, 1.000, 9.200, 0.000, 0.000, 0
point.3= 4, -15.000, 2.400, -0.850, 9600, 0, 0.000, 20.000, 0.100, 1.000, 9.200, 0.000, 0.000, 0
point.4= 5, -15.000, -2.400, -0.850, 9600, 0, 0.000, 40.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.600, 0.500, 0.500, 0
point.5= 5, -15.000, 2.400, -0.850, 9600, 0, 0.000, 40.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.600, 0.500, 0.500, 0
point.6= 1, 0.000, 0.000, -0.900, 0, 0, 0.300, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 1.000, 1.000, 0

max_number_of_points=9
 

;) Added command to translate aileron to the rudders for yoke steering. (aileron to rudder scale)
Quote
[airplane_geometry]
wing_area=444
wing_span=130
wing_root_chord= 6.400
wing_dihedral= 3.900
wing_incidence= 2.500
wing_twist= -1.700
oswald_efficiency_factor= 0.700
wing_winglets_flag= 0
wing_sweep= 2.960
wing_pos_apex_lon= -12.300
wing_pos_apex_vert= 0.000
htail_area= 1.000
htail_span= 1.000
htail_pos_lon= -27.800
htail_pos_vert= 0.000
htail_incidence= 2.000
htail_sweep= 5.000
vtail_area= 58.000
vtail_span= 14.800
vtail_sweep= 45.000
vtail_pos_lon= -25.700
vtail_pos_vert= 1.000
elevator_area= 16.600
aileron_area=160.000
rudder_area=400.000
elevator_up_limit= 28.00
elevator_down_limit= 21.00
aileron_up_limit= 70.0
aileron_down_limit= 70.0
rudder_limit= 45.0
elevator_trim_limit= 19.500
spoiler_limit= 20.000
spoilerons_available= 1
aileron_to_spoileron_gain= 2.000
min_ailerons_for_spoilerons= 0.000
min_flaps_for_spoilerons= 0.000
spoiler_handle_available=1
auto_spoiler_available=1
spoiler_extension_time=0.200000
positive_g_limit_flaps_up=4.000000
positive_g_limit_flaps_down=2.000000
negative_g_limit_flaps_up=-1.500000
negative_g_limit_flaps_down=-1.500000
aileron_to_rudder_scale=1.0 (Links ailerons to rudders)

;) My DeltaSim Malibu speedboat autopilot section (tuned to 40 knots cruise)
Quote
[autopilot]
autopilot_available=1
flight_director_available=1
default_vertical_speed=0001.0 // 1000.000000
autothrottle_available=1
pitch_takeoff_ga=8.000000
max_pitch= 1.0000000
max_pitch_acceleration= 10.000000
max_pitch_velocity_lo_alt= 20.000000
max_pitch_velocity_hi_alt= 1.500000
max_pitch_velocity_lo_alt_breakpoint= 20000.000000
max_pitch_velocity_hi_alt_breakpoint= 28000.000000
max_bank=6.20 // 20
max_bank_acceleration=1.800000 //The maximum angular bank acceleration, in degrees per second squared, that the autopilot will command left or right.
max_bank_velocity=3.000000 //The maximum angular bank velocity, in degrees per second, which the autopilot will command left or right.
max_throttle_rate=0.999999
nav_proportional_control=30.0 // 9.000000 // Proportional controller constant in lateral navigation modes.
nav_integrator_control=0.250000 // Integral controller constant in lateral navigation modes.
nav_derivative_control=0.005000 // Derivative controller constant in lateral navigation modes.
nav_integrator_boundary=1.2500  // 2.500000 // The boundary, or maximum signal error, in degrees in which the integrator function is active. In the example, the integrator is active when the error is between -2.5 and +2.5 degrees from the centerline of the navigation signal.
nav_derivative_boundary=1.000  // 0.000000 // The boundary, or maximum signal error, in degrees in which the derivative function is active. In the example, the derivative controller is not active because the maximum error is set to 0.
gs_proportional_control=9.520000
gs_integrator_control=0.260000
gs_derivative_control=0.000000
gs_integrator_boundary=0.700000
gs_derivative_boundary=0.000000
yaw_damper_gain=1.000000
autothrottle_arming_required=0
autothrottle_takeoff_ga=0
autothrottle_max_rpm=1000000
default_bank_mode=0
direction_indicator=0
attitude_indicator=0
use_no_default_bank=1
use_no_default_pitch=1
default_pitch_mode=0
yaw_slip_control_gain=0.000000
yaw_control_uses_trim=0.000000

Good Luck!   ??? :P ;)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: marc2140 on August 15, 2015, 04:47:44 PM
That'll keep me busy for some time....(lol).
Thanks, If I come any further, I'll let you know.
Marcel
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: marc2140 on August 16, 2015, 06:23:34 PM
I had my first minor success today, Jeff.
I downloaded the Jelair ottopilot at:
http://www.fs-shipyards.org/index.php?ind=downloads&op=section_view&idev=13
It is an fs2004 gauge.
Then I downloaded the "High sea salvage tugboat A.Bourbon" (don't know exactly where anymore), and after some trial and error I managed to get the gauge fixed in the boat. (putting the cab file directly in the gauge folder, and adapting the gauge reference in the panel text.
I tried it out with a flightplan from Juneau to Skagway (because of the somewhat larger water) and guess what: it worked. The autopilot was very reactive and kept the track rather well.
This is what it looked like. A bit primitive, I agree, but it gives me courage to continue. A small applause is welcome after all these hours...
cheers
Marcel

Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on August 16, 2015, 06:48:44 PM
Yes, it has it's exhilarating moments.  Each corner is a nail-biter.  Try navigating a narrow dogleg channel, or plotting course changes through an island chain.  A tight steering AP is sweet.  Congrats on getting it going.   8)

It's nice to have a boater around here.  It gets lonely sometimes, just Doug and I.  The boaters are a quiet lot.  Many, many hits on the website.  But nobody ever talks about it.  Funny.   :-\
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on August 18, 2015, 09:01:17 AM
Jellaire Autopilot

Well this is really great, good find! (Thank you Marcel!!!). Rod "altered" the background for the gauge a little to give it a "wooden" background, but other than that, this is the original gauge.  I've attached a zip with the revised background.  The instructions for using the gauge are in the zip.  I've also attached a zip of my present panel.cfg for the Smitt Rotterdam (DeltaSim) if anybody wants it, but this should work on any of the boats if you have any of the DeltaSim boats.

This is a great addition for the boats area of RTMM.  Now to figure out a sail plan without needing to start on a runway! :-)

Doug

PS ... for the new folks, click on the picture and it will enlarge, click again and it goes back.

Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: stiletto2 on August 18, 2015, 10:44:26 AM
Hi Doug,

I see a download option for the panel.cfg and for the .jpg pic.   There is no zip for the revised .cab that I can see. 

Rod
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on August 18, 2015, 10:50:27 AM
OK, it is on there now, Rod. Thank you.  I just, for the fun of it, made a "sail plan" from Misty's Place to Port Protection using Plan G and using the SPBs as start, finish points. Sailing it now, really works great so far.  This opens up a whole new aspect for us using the boats at RTMM.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: stiletto2 on August 18, 2015, 11:04:27 AM
Hi Doug,

Yes, I see the zip now.   Also, you are right about other possibilities. One word of caution on your panel.cfg.
These configs are pretty specific to each model set since they have specialized gauges.  For example, your panel.cfg as provided will not work properly with my DeltaSim Malibu 32.

Rod 
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on August 18, 2015, 11:06:44 AM
OK, so one will have to be for "each" one.  Tell me, do you have the Smitt Rotterdam? We'll have to label them for each of the boats we are using. Good idea.

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: stiletto2 on August 18, 2015, 11:13:24 AM
At this point, I only have the Malibu32.   

Rod
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on August 18, 2015, 11:16:38 AM
That makes sense to have one for each boat ... that "protects" the DeltaSim people, you only use that one if you have BOUGHT that boat.  He is using same gauges for the other big boats, so I might not have to change much. I could also make a "generic" one using Cessna Guages ... I think there is a wind speed/direction gauge I can use. That would keep us out of copyright problems.  I'll look into it.

So far, the Rotterdam is tracking the Mistys to Port Protection sail plan just fine.  Setting these up to go from SPB to SPB works great in Plan-G.  What a great way to just sit back and relax, read a book, while sailing along. We will have some fun with these.

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on August 18, 2015, 12:02:12 PM
Testing the new "sail plan" and the new Jellaire Nav Gauge

... and just when you thought it was safe to sit back, relax and take a snooze or enjoy a good book ... ah, there's something on the horizon!  And soon is all his "rusty freighter glory" Dex sails past.  I'll always say that Dex Thomas' AI Shipping/Boats project absolutely makes realism at RTMM work.  What fun to have a freighter show up and pass by closely. (And you better pay attention to "dodge" if they get too close).

UPDATE: Made Port Protection before nightfall in a rainstorm. Safely docked. The new Nav gauge tracked all the way with NO problems. We encountered about 8 or 10 of Dex's ships.  The cruise took from 10:50 AM until 3:12 PM ... about 4 hours.  A headwind will slow you down and a tail wind will speed you up, so you can only estimate a trip like this.  Again, no glitches. This works perfectly. It was a Plan-G going from SPB to SPB.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on August 18, 2015, 06:47:48 PM
Nice way to end the day ...

Running a new Sail Plan from Port Protection to Sitka. I make these fairly close to the shoreline because some folks will be using smaller boats, so they would naturally stay near shore. The new autopilot is really great. I can sit back, listen to Pandora and read an Ebook on my Kindle ... relaxing way to spend an evening.

Doug
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: marc2140 on August 18, 2015, 08:34:47 PM
Nice that you like the new Otto-pilot, guys.
I wanted to see what it did under tougher conditions, so I did the Grenville Channel cruise from Prince Rupert to Hartley Bay. But really no problem. At times I thought now it's going to hit the shore, but no at the last moment it corrected itself.
But indeed you have to stay alert for the AI shipping traffic. With combinations of RTMM AI shipping + the Henrik Nielsen packages traffic is getting dense sometimes.
I am now going to try it out on other ships to see if they react and track just as well. Maybe for some vessels corrections in the aircraft.cfg are necessary.
There are still a lot of ideas I have, that we could develop in this water/boat section. I think I will round them up in another topic.
In the meantime, just like Doug, I want to enjoy the scenery and the peace that the water brings, during the cruises.
for yr info, I attach the panel.cfg file as it looks now on my big tugboat.
Cheers
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on August 18, 2015, 09:50:35 PM
Marcel, which tug are you using?  Jeff and I put a "marina" section into "The Moorings" part of RTMM. Maybe we should start there and get a nice little fleet. Then get the panel.cfg's set up for each one.  I'm playing with sail plans right now and not having a problem. If you have one that works going down the Grenville Channel, shoot it to me.  I'll keep these in one place so we can come up with a Sail Plan section. We have some boat trips in there now, but this opens up a whole new vista.

Something Jeff and I are talking about. I made one plan that I call "open".  You get in the boat, set a heading and go to a waypoint (Plan G shows them all over the place), then as you make the waypoints, you put the next one into the GPS, or set a heading.  It is not "automatic" ... but you are using the new nav autopilot all the time. This seems pretty realistic. For a "closed" plan (like the one I'm testing now) you go from SPB to SPB. Once it is checked out, you don't have to touch anything ... good for an evenings relaxation. I sort of like the "hands on" (open) plan ... it seems more fun to me. But we could make both for folks.  Since we are also into PNW now, I guess we could think about a series that would give us the whole "Inside Passage" like the cruise ships up there do. For folks that will never be in that part of the world, they could experience this great trip virtually.

Also, because of all the 'big water' we have ... a pilotable cruise ship actually would make sense for the marina (we'll need a bigger pier I think!)

As an example, the "open" plan could be as simple as the pic below ...

Doug
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: marc2140 on August 19, 2015, 08:01:56 AM
My tugboat is the FSX Pilotable High Sea Salvage Tugboat downloadable at http://simviation.com/1/browse-Misc-58-15 (http://simviation.com/1/browse-Misc-58-15).
It seems to be a well known boat with several video's on Youtube.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTKokuV5uwg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTKokuV5uwg) (2videos follow each other - is in french)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5Na8EY1irA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T5Na8EY1irA)
My adapted panel.cfg file is in my previous post in the thead.
Cheers
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: marc2140 on August 19, 2015, 04:42:30 PM
I like your idea about a little fleet Doug.
But then I feel that we should improve the quality of the ships. And that means more than just adding an auto pilot.
It means ships with reverse thrust, push back options, anchoring options, etc.
I spent some hours today on reading through forums and found a lot of interesting things.
A Mr. Chuck Backus seems to know a lot about this.
Here is a youtube video on how he improved the FDE of a standard Delta-sim yacht.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4Fo3xHkmOE&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4Fo3xHkmOE&feature=youtu.be)
The whole thread about this boat developments is at http://www.flightsim.com/vbfs/showthread.php?274838-Planes-Or-Watercraft&highlight=napamule2 (http://www.flightsim.com/vbfs/showthread.php?274838-Planes-Or-Watercraft&highlight=napamule2)
Unfortunately I did not manage to get the 180 yacht functioning in my fsx. But I think I am going to try and contact the guy.
Have a nice evening
Marcel
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on August 19, 2015, 07:59:21 PM
Keep us posted if you get hold of him. You might tell him what we are trying to do and see if he has any suggestions. I agree with you, we need reverse, etc. The darned Smitt Rotterdam (DeltaSim) only gets going if you turn it into a float plane, get that going, then switch back). Maybe we can fix quirks as we go.

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on August 19, 2015, 08:07:04 PM
Hmmm, that's funny.  My Smit Rotterdam does have very good reverse thrust, and responds to the regular GPS.  I was not able to make the OTTOpilot work in it though.  It would do crescent switchbacks back and forth across the path of travel.  I think it was searching for land.  I got beached several times before getting away from Misty's Place.  Probably because my boat is tuned to the regular autopilot, and is not "stock".  If I used a default set of config files, it probably would work.  I don't know.  :-\

I thought that 180's movements were kinda strange.  It was like the props or jets were mounted in the center of the boat.  And was that an autopilot demo, or was he just maneuvering around manually?   :-\
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jsapair on August 19, 2015, 09:47:36 PM
Doug, could you post the Port Protection FP  here? Big fan of the TV show but I'm not sure exactly where it is. POW Island?

                                             jsapair
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on August 19, 2015, 09:54:56 PM
Doug, could you post the Port Protection FP  here? Big fan of the TV show but I'm not sure exactly where it is. POW Island?

                                             jsapair
Scroll up to reply number 102.   ::)

Link is under the map, at the bottom.  ;)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Handie on August 20, 2015, 01:26:29 PM
If you don't like steering with your rudder pedals, there is a fix for that also, in the aircraft.cfg file, to switch to ailerons which means steering with the yoke.
Hello Jeff,

I installed the Sirocco with your files "Scirocco Autopilot From Jeff Greene (03/31/11)"
How to use my Yoke to steer the boat, I do not have rudder pedals?
Should we remove the line "aileron_to_rudder_scale // 0.4 = 100.0 (Links to fin rudders)" in the aircraft.cfg?

Moreover, in this aircraft.cfg, why are there 2 times more [fltsim.x] than in the original file? What do those who have "-1" in addition ?

Thank you  ;)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jsapair on August 20, 2015, 04:34:45 PM
Scroll up to reply number 102.   ::)

Link is under the map, at the bottom.  ;)


Thanks, Jeff. I missed the fine print.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on August 20, 2015, 08:14:00 PM
If you don't like steering with your rudder pedals, there is a fix for that also, in the aircraft.cfg file, to switch to ailerons which means steering with the yoke.
Hello Jeff,

I installed the Sirocco with your files "Scirocco Autopilot From Jeff Greene (03/31/11)"
How to use my Yoke to steer the boat, I do not have rudder pedals?
Should we remove the line "aileron_to_rudder_scale // 0.4 = 100.0 (Links to fin rudders)" in the aircraft.cfg?

Moreover, in this aircraft.cfg, why are there 2 times more [fltsim.x] than in the original file? What do those who have "-1" in addition ?

Thank you  ;)

Hi Nadine,
     You don't have rudder pedals? ???  How do you steer when taxiing?  That is also how you steer a boat.  I prefer to steer the boat with my flight yoke, rather than twisting my pedals.  If you want to turn off "yoke steering", just put two of these ---> // marks before the "aileron_to_rudder_scale=" line.  That will turn it off, making steering normal (default). 
     The only difference between the default boats and the extra ones is a line called "UI_type=" in which I added "airplane", where it was blank originally.  I am checking on that now, with my sim.  It has been a few years since this project was done.

     Going boating, . . . back in a bit!  ;)

(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m531/jeff3163/MOON/Flight%20Simulator%20X%20Files/2015/Prepar3D%202015-08-20%2017-46-09-73.jpg~original)
(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m531/jeff3163/MOON/Flight%20Simulator%20X%20Files/2015/Prepar3D%202015-08-20%2019-56-06-06.jpg~original)

     Ok, I am back.  I tried both "versions" tracking the autopilot.  The "-1" versions seem to track better, more tightly.  I only added the characters "-1" to the boats' names to make them different than the originals names.  You can delete the added entries if they bother you, or are unwanted.  But they seem to work better.  Try one, and see.  The boats steering seems a little too radical, but I suppose I was trying to get it to turn better.  Be gentle with the steering.  ;)

     You could add to the UI_type= line the word "airplane" in the [flightsim.x] boats that don't have them, then delete the "-1" copies from the list.  Numbers 3,4, and 5, I believe.  Then you would only have the three boats.  One blue, one red, and one white.  ;)

Ha ha ha ha ha . . .  ;D
(http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m531/jeff3163/MOON/Flight%20Simulator%20X%20Files/2015/Prepar3D%202015-08-20%2018-22-47-08.jpg~original)
That's funny.  So very funny.   ;D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Handie on August 21, 2015, 06:30:39 AM
Hi Jeff,

As it is difficult to understand and to be understood when we do not speak the same language  :(

Yes, I use the rudder, but on my joystick, in twisting the handle to the right or the left, to steer my aircraft on the ground (or on the water for amphibious and floats) or the boats on the water.
What I do not have, is a rudder with pedals.

Yesterday, when I tested the Sirocco with your files, I could not steer the boat with the rudder of my joystick, it ignored my actions and continued straight.
By cons, in serving me the handle of the joystick, in swinging to the right or the left, the boat goes at right or left.

What I would like, is that the boat turns right and  left by using the twist of the handle (rudder mode), as for the aircraft on the ground, and not in swinging the handle to the right or the left as for aircraft in flight ;)

I have not yet tested the autopilot ; for now, I just tried to steer the boat manually.

For the rest, I will try to better understand and continue testing, thank you :)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on August 21, 2015, 07:54:31 AM
Good morning Nadine,
     I understand you.  Sorry if you are not understanding something I've said.  I will use the translator.  I was pretty sure you had a twisting joystick.  In that case, just disable that line, like this:

Ok.  Open your airplane.cfg file and edit the line for aileron_to_rudder_scale=1.00/0.04.  You can delete the line, or you can place two slashes (//) before the line.  Your choice.  Make it look like this:

//aileron_to_rudder_scale=1.00 / 0.04

. . . or just delete that line.  Either way will "turn it off".
--------------------------------
Bonjour Nadine,
      Je vous comprends. Désolé si vous ne comprenez pas quelque chose que je l'ai dit. Je vais utiliser le traducteur. Je me doutais bien que vous aviez un joystick torsion. Dans ce cas, il suffit de désactiver cette ligne, comme ceci:

D'accord. Ouvrez votre fichier airplane.cfg et modifier la ligne pour aileron_to_rudder_scale = 1.00 / 0.04. Vous pouvez supprimer la ligne, ou vous pouvez placer deux barres obliques (//) avant la ligne. Ton choix. Faire ressembler à ceci:

// aileron_to_rudder_scale = 1.00 / 0.04

. . . ou tout simplement supprimer cette ligne. De toute façon sera "éteindre".
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Handie on August 21, 2015, 02:49:25 PM
Thank you very much, Jeff, it works very well like that  :)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on August 21, 2015, 04:09:00 PM
Little Sail Plan for folks to play with ...

Would you like a nice short evening cruise from Misty's Place over to Herring Bay, or back? Here's one you can put int with your "flight plans" that will get you there. The starting positions are on the map. those will put you right at the boat docks for each (Misty's has a new boat dock). This is a good "example" plan for someone trying the boats ... takes about a half hour. Best toward sunset. (zip file is in fine print under map pic)

Zip Sail Plan Updated 8:29 PM EST
NOTAM: (Interesting, I cannot get the "reverse" (from Herring Bay to Misty's) to start out on the water runway, it tries to start from the Helipad. So there now is no "return" trip.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Handie on August 21, 2015, 04:32:47 PM
Thanks Doug  :)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on August 21, 2015, 09:17:01 PM
Returning from Herring Bay

Left the Diner at Sunset, arrived at Misty's Place after dark. The new "reverse" (F2 Hold) is working great and parking at the dock was very easy.  This is a pic of the new dock at Misty's Place.  Coming back at night, the channel is well lit with red and green buoys.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: marc2140 on August 22, 2015, 10:44:04 AM
Don't see the new boat dock, Doug.
Where can I find it or the file?
Cheers
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Handie on August 22, 2015, 10:53:44 AM
With the new version of the scenery "Misty's Place " ;)

http://return.mistymoorings.com/scenery/#m
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on August 22, 2015, 02:47:48 PM
Handie is correct, you need the updated Misty's Place.

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: marc2140 on August 23, 2015, 03:45:22 AM
Thx Nadine and Doug.
Got it fixed.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: spud on August 23, 2015, 09:42:56 AM
One thing I noticed is that IF you have the Medivac scenery active there are two of these docks at Mistys side by side.  No biggie as the Medivac dock has the Hospitial signs on the ends to help keep misc. craft clear.  The dock next door is for 'regular' water traffic.
 8)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: Doug on August 23, 2015, 04:34:58 PM
That's why I put in that second dock. ('of course, people from New Jersey wouldn't notice the Medical Only signs ...) but thought "starting" there would not look good, so I made the second dock nearby.

D
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on August 23, 2015, 06:28:13 PM


Are we still talking about "Working on the Boats"?  Let's not get off topic in this thread, please.

Thanks.  :)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jsapair on August 23, 2015, 10:25:15 PM
Jeff and Nadine...I love it when you speak French. Brings out the Peter Sellers in me. Where's Cato?
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on August 23, 2015, 11:02:25 PM
Jeff and Nadine...I love it when you speak French. Brings out the Peter Sellers in me. Where's Cato?

Speak French?  Ha ha ha.  Never been accused of that before!!   :o  ;D

This isn't getting us back on topic.  I thought I had a short attention span.  Boats people, this is about working on boats!  Focus.
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: spud on August 24, 2015, 11:00:58 AM
Boats? Boats!,
boats are just big holes in the water you try to fill with money.
 8)
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: marc2140 on August 26, 2015, 01:50:41 PM
Hi Doug
I was trying out the minipanel that you attached in reply #100.
But it does not give me the wooden background (background= 0.0.0 in the file).
And I don't have the gauges 02 nor 03, although I like them very much.
I put in a speed indicator from the fletcher ship (freeware), but I was not able to find a good wind speed and direction gauge.
Is the gauge you use, available somewhere or do you have alternatives?
Mine looks like this now; not so nice...
Thx
Marcel
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: stiletto2 on August 26, 2015, 04:20:54 PM
Hi Marc,

The link for the mini panel with the wood background is underneath a picture towards the bottom of page 7 of this thread.  The wood is painted into the .cab file so the "background" parameter is not used.

Rod
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: jeff3163 on August 26, 2015, 07:55:59 PM
It wouldn't be page seven for me, Rod.  I've only got three pages for this thread.  I have fifty replies per page.  So it is a relative perspective.  Which reply number was it? 
Title: Re: Working on the boats.
Post by: stiletto2 on August 27, 2015, 09:04:28 AM
Good point.....it is reply #100

Rod